Supernatural Wiki
Supernatural Wiki



Hi, welcome to Supernatural Wiki! Thanks for your edit to the User talk:Calebchiam page.

Please leave a message on my talk page if I can help with anything! -- Calebchiam (Talk) 15:04, 4 March 2011


Feel free to go ahead and create the page. As long as it makes sense, it's fine to create the article. Likewise for any other articles you might want to create. Thanks. Calebchiam Talk 03:20, March 5, 2011 (UTC)

Gods page.[]

Hello there and welcome to this wiki foundation! I really like the article titled "Gods" that you constructed; it makes a great addition to the database here.
If you have any question, thoughts, and opinions please don't hesitate to post a message on my Talk page.

Anderson54, March 5th 2011

Other Wikis[]

Hey there!! No, this is not the only wiki that has good information, wiki templates, character biographies and other Supernatural related stuff. In fact, I also contribute to a wiki called Super-Wiki, which in my opinion, has better information to Supernatural related stuff. But don't get me wrong, this wiki is still resourceful and great.

Anderson54, March 5th 2011

Re: Gods page.[]

To answer your question, yes and no. While in most respects the page is formal, some of the information you’ve posted is obscure and somewhat speculative, e.g., the stuff about the ancient, higher level, young gods is not exactly Canonical, as it seems more of an opinion than fact itself because the show itself hasn’t given those titles to them. But still, in my honest opinion, yes I think there are different levels of divinity in Gods. So with that said, I may change some stuff; nothing too major though just minor stuff.

Anderson54, March 7th 2011

Re: Soul pg.[]

Hello there!! I got your message and thank you for creating the "Soul" page here, and yes, it is definitely a "hot topic" or a tight fixture for Season 6. The whole thing interests me a whole lot :) I made all the changes to the page that I thought it needed; feel free to check them out.

Anderson54, March 9th 2011

Hey, could you please share your opinion on the monster strength-scale on its blog by 123bante123... -- ImperiexSeed, 12:50 PM, January 14th 2012


In a way, the term "magic" is universal, encompassing lots of different things, while sometimes it can be limited. In this case, I'd say leave the already-existing page, and document all the different types of magic, used by angels, gods, demons, witches, fairies, etc. -- ImperiexSeed, 3:18 PM, January 15th 2012


Yes, I heard your request to become an admin, but didn't have an answer at that point.. To become an admin, you first need certain qualities. Qualities include, but are not limited to, leadership, outgoing, and respectful. I personally find you to be kind, and smart, despite your grammar mistakes, which you don't do often, anyways. Tell you what, you just keep editing, and you'll be on your to becoming one! :) Happy editing. -- ImperiexSeed, 3:32 PM, January 15th 2012

I just made you the chat moderator to start you off, so enjoy, and please don't abuse your powers, which I doubt you will. -- ImperiexSeed, 3:40 PM, January 15th 2012

I'm pretty sure there not[]

I'm pretty sure there not monsters, or eve's creations for one thing, they were created by oberon king of the fairies, for another they reside in there own dimension, only coming here when summoned, also they have own different types and species, rather than with monsters, you only have one type, per monster, there is also the fact, they posses such great powers, which most monsters don't, they don't eat people, and they are ruled by oberon. General MGD 109 00:54, January 22, 2012 (UTC)

I'm sorry, I thought you were talking about something else, nether mind. General MGD 109 10:09, January 22, 2012 (UTC)

Well, it's definitely a possibly of the credits misspelling the name, however there are some many names going around, that I don't know what's legit. Tell you what, however you think it's spelled, is what you can title the page. :) -- ImperiexSeed, 6:07 PM, January 27th 2012

Hey, could you meet me on chat for a minute? -- ImperiexSeed, 3:36 PM, February 4th 2012

I need an answer on something, could you please meet me on chat.. -- ImperiexSeed, 10:55 PM, February 20th 2012

Should we have dreamwalking as a page?[]

Hello, following the admin asking me if I had any ideas for a page, I came up with dreamwalking, as many beings, Angels, Archangels, Sephirms, Higher demons ect can go into peoples dreams, and even manipulate them, well he's unsure wether it should have a page or it should be classed as a form of telepathy, so we decided to ask other uses what they think of it, so if you would be so kind as to tell him what you think, it will be much appreciated, thank you. General MGD 109 19:37, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

Thank you, but don't tell me, tell him, its his discision, Its just my idea. General MGD 109 19:42, February 25, 2012 (UTC)

I have two quick questions that I need answers to, so please meet me on chat. -- ImperiexSeed, 4:16 PM, March 3rd 2012


Sure, I'll be right there.General MGD 109 00:29, March 4, 2012 (UTC)

It seems okay now, just slow. General MGD 109 00:39, March 4, 2012 (UTC)

Are you still there? I lost connection, and now there seems to be a problem, I don't know how much your getting. General MGD 109 00:53, March 4, 2012 (UTC)

I'll come off, and go back on, and see if that makes a differance. General MGD 109 01:04, March 4, 2012 (UTC)

Okay, I have talk to you later. General MGD 109 01:12, March 4, 2012 (UTC)

The Locationstemplate needs minor tweaking. Could you please fix the mistakes, because they're making the Whereabouts section indented. Go to the page, and fix it. -- ImperiexSeed, 8:34 PM, March 10th 2012



How time flys man, i never thought u would be a "Supernatural" fan like I am, but i guess we never got the chance to know each other well. if u wanna catch up i can be found on here. I would really like to see an old friend. Phantombeast. ('Talk') 22:03, April 3, 2012 (UTC)

Just me - ImperiexSeed. I propose a merger, combining info on Ailments control and Moluckinesis into one. Do happen to know the kenetic name for controlling diseases. When/if found, get back to me. -- ImperiexSeed, 10:42 PM, April 4th 2012

Thanks for bringing it to my attention. Cas, while wielding all of Purgatory's souls possessed astounding High-level Reality Warping power. Wait, so the quote said, "We need to keep Michael and Lucifer's Cage"? Very well, so either he wasn't able to beat Michael or Michael's stronger. -- ImperiexSeed, 9:53 PM, June 20th 2012

It would be completely obliged if you meet me on chat. -- ImperiexSeed, 8:01 PM, July 29th 2012

On a unfair matter[]

Hello, I writting to you, on the Matter, that our Admin ImperiexSeed, was initially granted his request for a Bureaucrat position, but was then only minutes later denied, on the grounds that the User believed he exploited his position and abused his powers. Acting like was better than other users and such. To get the full Gist of it, go to his page and read what they have written.

I find this both unfair and incorect, and I believe you will agree with me, as such I wrote a complaint to the Wiki staff, and I'm writting to request you do the same. After all our Admin doesn't abuse his powers, and is in perfect right to recieve a Bureaucrat position.

In case you are unsure how to do this. Here are two links. or

The first one is the one I used, the second is if you want to contanct a certain member of the centeral Staff. Any way which one you chose is your decision. Well thats about it, I'm sure you agree with me, on the fact that these claims are both inaccurate and unfair, so thank you, if you have any questions write to me, or if you want ask him himself. General MGD 109 20:32, June 28, 2012 (UTC)

Exactly where does it say in Salute to Supernatural New Jersey 2010 that gods didn't gain power from worship and why they are normally beyond demons.

Salute to Supernatural Vancouver 2010)

I'm looking throughout all these videos and its just them goofing around.

Could you meet me on chat?

Thanks for altering me, I commend it. First off, let's ask: What is canon? Canon is what's said or seen in the series. So since Death untruthfully said in the end he will reap God, it can be mentioned in articles on the Supernatural wiki. Now do I agree with it, no. I myself also asked him to stop doing things that he continuously did. On my talk page, he told he'd stop, so I recommend you ask him. -- ImperiexSeed, 8:41 PM, November 26th 2012

Mentioning Vancouver, New Jersey[]

You were saying stuff about the pagans and gods were mentioned in Vancouver, do you recall who said them ?

I'm on chat now. General MGD 109 (talk) 21:33, January 28, 2013 (UTC)

Sorry, I won't be able to do that, as I've got to go now, how about we talk tommorow? General MGD 109 (talk) 22:43, January 28, 2013 (UTC)

All right fair enough. But Sam did make it clear that they drew a large amount of power from sacrifices, which would be a part of worship. Chronos had to make his own sacrifices for himself so he could have control over his powers. Of course it makes sense that they don't draw power from whether or not people believe in them, but it has been verfied they do draw power from worshippers (worshippers implies that people worship them, otherwise they would just say believers)

HeWhoCannotBeDestroyed (talk) 03:27, March 26, 2013 (UTC)

Response to re-editing Deities page[]

Worshipers implies that people worship them. Otherwise they would just be called believers. You can believe in a god without worshipping it. Sam has confirmed that the gods were weakened when people stopped worshipping them (this includes sacrifices). For verification, please watch Time After Time (Season 7, Episode 12)

Holy White Light/Angels' True Form[]

Holy White Light is an attack precisely executed, generally initiated through a vessel's hand/palm - a clear demonstration of will. When 'seen', the phisology of an Angel can blind and deafen mortals. These two, here, certainly differentiate from each other. Metatron's presence, when he brushed by, deteriorated Crowley's vessel's skin, sizzling it off. -- ImperiexSeed, 4:32 PM, May 2nd 2013

I do not appreciate your tone. So, STOP - and talk to me nicely. But, yes, we can drop this. -- ImperiexSeed, 4:58 PM, May 2nd 2013
Ok, for your information, I, as a user, can edit whatever page I want except for userpages. So, by that standard, I can edit your talk page. You, actually, were taking a tone. Have a good one, buddy. -- ImperiexSeed, 6:35 PM, May 2nd 2013

If your on now, we can do it now. General MGD 109 (talk) 19:28, June 5, 2013 (UTC)

Tense Usage[]

Hello. Imperiex and I were just wondering if you would like to be one of the advocates for the creation and policing proper tense usage in the wiki? It's mainly about ensuring narrative articles are in the past tense, and that other users/contributors know about this. It would really be great if you join us in this campaign/crusade or whatever you call it. Please leave a message on my or Imperiex's talk page. The forum on tense guidelines/policy is here . FTWinchester (talk) 02:26, June 6, 2013 (UTC)


Sure. I have work in the afternoons to evenings, though. My timezone is central. I'm usually available during the day. Hope to catch you next time. FTWinchester (talk) 02:12, June 12, 2013 (UTC)


Thank you, Twilight Despair 5 :) RaghavD Taking the ROAD less travelled 04:00, June 21, 2013 (UTC)

Thanks. I'll keep that in mind. Btw what are your thoughts on including a countdown clock to the season 9 page?RaghavD Taking the ROAD less travelled 17:34, June 21, 2013 (UTC)

Since the episodes are first telecasted in the US, the clock has to be timed to it. There is no question of bias.RaghavD Taking the ROAD less travelled 17:51, June 21, 2013 (UTC)

You raised a good point. First let us see whether the clock idea will be approved or not.RaghavD Taking the ROAD less travelled 07:04, June 22, 2013 (UTC)

Okay, Twilight Despair 5, I'll try my best to come to a compromise over this little matter. Espcially considering I helpped start it. General MGD 109 (talk) 18:18, July 31, 2013 (UTC)

I understand your points, and I get that was your intention, but if its causing so many problems it might be best to cut it all off, and only mention it in the trivia section as you suggested. But as I said, that is simply one solution there are probably others we can explore. I simply felt it would be the easiest solution, but if your really agaist it, I am willing to try others. I also understand the possibility on the word "Pagan" but I don't think we can do much about that, as is straight out of the show. You know I often wonder if we would have any of these problems if someone had made the mistake of including Hindu deties in with the other Pagans, how could they have thought that would be a good idea? General MGD 109 (talk) 22:03, July 31, 2013 (UTC)

I see your point, but we shouldn't let any one or few user(s), dicktate what is canon and not canon worthy of telling and what is right to keep separate and together. Meaning, as it in canon God is seen as a deity by Angels, Humans, even by other deities at least as a higher one, than it canon. But, here is a compromise if we cannot keep the mention of God and the other beings with similar status on the front of the page. That it be moved to the trivia God and all being views like god, and that at least God keep the cateogory deity as that is a fact of the show. But I also think, we should not removed, but reduce the word pagan on the page. Like, overstating a title or full name is tacty in wrighting. It would be like say Dean Winchester everytime, his name would be used in an sentence. Like stating every so often, pagan gods/deities is completely ok. But too many times, and it seems like we are trying to hard to show it, you see what I mean.[[User:Twilight Despair 5|]] ([[The God of Creation]]) (talk) 04:28, August 1, 2013 (UTC)

Re: Your blog[]

I'm currently sick, And you? Sure I'll take a look at it. FTWinchester (talk) 14:59, February 1, 2014 (UTC)

Looked at it and loved it. I prepared a rather expansive input on your blog, and I really liked the fact that your arc has so many interesting and epic possibilities. FTWinchester (talk) 14:59, February 1, 2014 (UTC)

Yea sorry. I took a few days away from here so I forgot to check if there has been a response. I'm looking into it now. FTWinchester (talk) 23:39, February 19, 2014 (UTC)


Hi Twilight, just letting you know that I've seen your request and will do a detailed check on your contributions later on next week. Cheers. Calebchiam Talk 05:15, November 22, 2014 (UTC)

Hey, sorry for the late response. Since you mentioned that you'd be willing to create a userblog for the adminship request, please take a look at Supernatural Wiki:Requests for adminship and follow the instructions to create your RfA at Supernatural Wiki:Requests for adminship/Twilight_Despair_5. I'll close in it a week once other users have voted on it, and you may post on users' talk pages to seek their input (emphasis on input - it would be in bad taste to ask users to vote in your favour). Let me know if you need any help, cheers. Calebchiam Talk 16:14, December 1, 2014 (UTC)
Please read through and follow the instructions on the RfA page. A user blog is not how you do it, I'm afraid. Calebchiam Talk 01:44, December 2, 2014 (UTC)

Re: Hey[]

I created your RfA page. You can find it here. RaghavD'"Look into my eyes. It’s where my demons hide" 16:55, December 5, 2014 (UTC)

Yeah, I think so. RaghavD'"Look into my eyes. It’s where my demons hide" 17:42, December 5, 2014 (UTC)

Those are not my questions, buddy. They came with the template for RfA. Anyway good job on the questions! Let's wait for Calebchiam now. RaghavD'"Look into my eyes. It’s where my demons hide" 16:56, December 6, 2014 (UTC)


Hello, EmpyreanSmoke here. If you have the time, I would like to talk in private. Do you have a Facebook, Twitter, Kik, or some other form of place where would could chat in private? Please message me back as soon as you can. Thanks in advance.—Preceding unsigned comment added by (talkcontribs)

Successful RfA[]

Congratulations! You can now do the following:

  • Edit and move fully protected pages
  • Delete, restore, and view deleted revisions of pages and images
  • Protect pages from edits, moves, or creation by non-sysops
  • Block and unblock users and IP addresses and ranges
  • Edit the interface pages in the MediaWiki: namespace
  • View Special:Unwatchedpages

If you have any questions, feel free to ask. Cheers. Calebchiam Talk 04:41, December 20, 2014 (UTC)

Congrats, TD5! Good to have you on board. :) RaghavD'"Look into my eyes. It’s where my demons hide" 12:39, December 20, 2014 (UTC)

Congratulations, TD5! Glad to have someone like you on the team! FTWinchester (talk) 13:04, December 20, 2014 (UTC)

Yeah sure, man. Will keep that in mind. RaghavD'"Look into my eyes. It’s where my demons hide" 15:54, December 20, 2014 (UTC)

Need your assistance[]

Hi, TD5. As you may have noticed, several users have been spamming flame and criticism war against each other apparently from an old argument they had from other websites. Discussion could be found here. I tried to find a way to mediate but things have gotten so blown out of proportion that the only option I see is to just block everyone involved as pretty much everyone had no significant contributions to the actual wiki itself. I would really appreciate for you to weigh in on this. Thanks. FTWinchester (talk) 23:34, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

I think it's quite alright. They've been banned and Caleb already stepped in that night on chat as things were wrapping up. Thanks for responding, though. Happy holidays! FTWinchester (talk) 13:47, December 25, 2014 (UTC)


Can you please add the leaderboard to this wiki? It would make editing more enjoyable. Also adding comments to the article would be nice.Dream Inspiration2014 (talk) 07:55, February 13, 2015 (UTC)

Ok that is fair. Thank you very much.Dream Inspiration2014 (talk) 18:07, February 13, 2015 (UTC)

Sally Owens[]

Can you do something about Sally Owens? He/she keeps putting up stuff like "Black Magic" and "White Magic" when neither are canon to Supernatural at all (I don't ever recall the two subjects even being mentioned, much less talked about or shown). It seems that he/she is putting information about Magic from other sources onto Witches when it holds no relevance to Supernatural whatsoever, and therefore is bias.

I explained it to him/her, and they have completely ignored it and re-edited it in. and seeing the history of the page, this is not the first time they have done this. Gabriel456 (talk) 00:35, March 16, 2015 (UTC)

That's ok, I just wanted to let you know. But thank you Gabriel456 (talk) 01:21, March 16, 2015 (UTC)

Thank you,

It is a great honor. I won't dissapoint any of you.

Assassin Abdullah (talk) 16:56, March 29, 2015 (UTC)


Hi there. I'm so sorry to bother you but could you please ban Degrassifan31? They're a sockpuppet from my main wiki (Degrassi Wiki) and they were banned by an admin on there are coming to me on here and no one is putting up with their crap. I'm so sorry that they're bring this issue to this wiki and you shouldn't have to put up with that at all. Thank you so much! Sarah (talk) 21:57, April 19, 2015 (UTC)

im not a sockpuppet (im his friend). why are you acting like this? you're the one acting immature.

Enough, first off please sign your post Degrass. You can do this by hitting the sign icon on your edit tools or by hitting ~ four times. Now I will have the other admins will review this claim of sockpuppeting. If it's proven to any real degree I'll with make a ban that fits. Until then I my hands are tied. But for your own case Degrass don't contact Thisoneperson user at least here, until after this affair is settled. I thank all of you for your Cooperation. [[User:Twilight Despair 5|]] ([[The God of Creation]]) (talk) 14:13, April 20, 2015 (UTC)


I've been having edit wars with Trip391 or EmpyreanSmoke for a little bit now regarding Sam. The most latest being that I edited Susan Carter's page saying that she shook Dean's hand and thanked and I didn't include Sam because she never actually shook his hand or thanked him, but because they're trying to bolster and equalize Sam to Dean (when the show makes it clear that Dean's the center of everything), every edit I do on pages regarding Sam if it has to do with just Dean getting thanked, etc, and Sam being left out, they keep undoing it simply because they can't wrap their heads around the fact that Sam's just Dean's shadow and just there to everyone, whereas Dean's getting all the kisses, 'thank you's,' the best lines, the ladies, he's good with kids, etc. Or like how on Andrea Barr's page I portrayed the scene as her only thanking Dean and kissing him, but they changed that too even though she did only thank Dean. I'm just letting you know because you're probably be hearing from at least one of them soon. -- ImperiexSeed, 1:34 AM, April 28th 2015

  • I'll just continue under here. First off, I did't realize you were an admin, because when you suggested to Imperiex on his blog that biased statements he makes because he doesn't like a character should remain in his blog, he ignored you completely and changed how he wrote the events of Family Remains on Susan Carter's page. He said this "I edited Susan Carter's page saying that she shook Dean's hand and thanked and I didn't include Sam because she never actually shook his hand or thanked him", but when watching the episode, you can see that after Susan shakes Dean's hand, she has to turn her body after shaking Sam's as well (this also makes sense since both brothers did help the Carter family). And he is correct when he says that when he's edited recently, and left information from out of an article, someone else has stepped in and corrected his incorrect and biased statement (he then starts edit warring against them). He also doesn't seem to understand that a wiki shouldn't really be concerned with how he feels about a character, but what accurately happened in an episode, without bias. I touched on some of that here (for your reference) when I just wrote to FTWinchester. Sorry for bothering you with this, but hopefully you and FTWinchester can help Imperiex understand that the wiki itself is not the place for his bias, and that it should stay in his blog (ironically, you told him that in his blog itself). Trip391 (talk) 05:47, April 28, 2015 (UTC)
    • Apparently Imperiex's hatred of Sam is applied towards Jared as well, which shouldn't really matter, except he can't keep these feelings in his personal blog, as was suggested/told to him. He wrote that "she enjoyed working with Jensen" on Katherine Boecher's article, which is correct, but not all the information. When she was at the VanCon 2010 convention, she went into much more detail about the scene where she (as Lilith) had to seduce Jared (as Sam), and how she loved doing it, and was said it was over (blah, blah, blah). Personally, I don't really care if the tidbit of information is in the article, but Imperiex's complete unwillingness to be neutral on the topic of Sam/Jared and Dean/Jensen is not good. Not only is this not constructive, but can turn readers away because, frankly, they don't care about his personal feelings on the character, but would rather learn more about Supernatural. Trip391 (talk) 04:20, May 10, 2015 (UTC)

Admin Rights[]

Hello, TD5. As you know, I used to be an admin, but my rights were removed roughly 6 months ago due to a misunderstanding (this is an understatement, but it's probably best if we don't go into this again, as I don't was another argument to arise). The bureaucrat CalebChiam removed my rights due to this incident, and said that if you and the rest of the community agreed, that he would return my rights back. You guys agreed that I should get my rights back within a matter of months. I jumped the gun, and requested my rights back nearly a month later. I admit, that was foolish, selfish, and very impatient of me. I was really excited, which caused me to ask too quickly, but this is no excuse. Because I have learned from my mistake, I have waited nearly 6 months before requesting my rights again. As you agreed that I get the rights back within a matter of months, and I have waited for almost half a year, I think it would be fair that I request for my rights back. As an admin, I will never, and I mean never abuse my power. I hate it when this happens, and the last thing I want to do is afflict that on this wiki. I will work hard to make the design ship shape, make sure the content is 100% accurate, and keep the trolls and spammers away. Some people have accused me of wanting extra rights for a "power grab", but that is not it at all. I will admit, having admin rights make me feel nice, but that is not why I want them. I want them because I love Supernatural, and love being on this wiki. I want to help the wiki grow, and keep it at its best. I love graphic design, and so admin rights would allow me to edit the home page and background. Once again, the last thing I would do is use my rights for personal gain, and promise to only use them to help the wiki. So what do you say? Will you give me another shot as an admin? Imagine what it feels like to get another shot at doing something you love. Feel free to leave a comment on my blog. EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 16:25, May 2, 2015 (UTC)

That is exactly what I am doing. CalebChiam said that if the admins and some established users didn't mind me getting my rights back, then he would return them. He didn't expect me to make an official page, as this isn't a matter of electing a new admin, this is deciding if CalebChiam should return my previous rights. In this case, I only need to show that the admins and and established users don't mind me having my rights back. Thanks for for responding. EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 02:26, May 3, 2015 (UTC)

Re: Community Choice Awards[]

Hello! What's your take on a community choice awards as suggested by wikia staff Gcheung28? Her complete proposal is at the bottom of my talk page. It looks interesting but I've been quite removed from recent episodes and I only focus more on clean up. Thanks! FTWinchester (talk) 17:14, May 15, 2015 (UTC)

Big Bad/S10[]

Hey! So I have a question. Who was the main villain(s) and secondary villain(s) of Season 10? I was gonna fix the Big Bad page but I'm only on Season 5 of the series so idk who it is in S10, but judging from what I've read on articles i'd say it was the Mark/Dean and Rowena as main. But I wanted an admins opinion first. Tysonjackson (talk) 06:58, May 23, 2015 (UTC)

On the topic of the Big Bads, we should seriously redefine what is constitutive for a villain to be considered a main or secondary villain of a given season, because right now it's crazily out of control, and it seems like people are globing all the villains of a season and labeling them either a main or secondary villain. -- ImperiexSeed, 3:03 AM, May 23rd 2015

I think it was the Mark of Cain was the main villain. Even if the Darkness was the true corrupting force that made the mark a curse, for season ten itself was trying to remove it. The darkness could be the season 10 secondary main villian as it was the true corrupting force. Rowena could be seen as a predominate secondary villian. As well as Cain when he became evil again. The Franksteins could be seems as other predominate villains for the end of the series. Crowley wasn't a villian directly this season neither was Metatron. This season I think had the most villians.[[User:Twilight Despair 5|]] ([[The God of Creation]]) (talk) 19:10, May 23, 2015 (UTC)

So Mark, Rowena, then the Styne's? I fixed it. How does it look? Also @ImperiexSeed, I noticed that you removed Jake from secondary villain. Why so? He was the primary threat they had to deal with other than Azazel and the Crossroad Demon. Tysonjackson (talk) 07:24, May 24, 2015 (UTC)

Standard for being a main or secondary villain/the Darkness[]

There should really be a specific, usable standard that we can use for what constitutes being a main or secondary villain, not just globing every villain that appears and piling it onto the page. That's not what the page was originally created for. Seeing as you have nothing to support saying that it's a magical force or a deity, your claims are weightless and neither of these should not be put on the wiki as being so till its confirmed. The reason being there's no way to determine anything that specific about it that can be in any way supported, because we don't know if it's a mind, a force, etc. Saying that it is a higher being is accurate, however. -- ImperiexSeed, 10:04 PM, May 23rd 2015

Yes, death did call it a force, but it could still be a mind, a consciousness. Calling it a magical force is at this point speculative. -- ImperiexSeed, 3:45 AM, May 24th 2015

A special thank you and goodbye![]

I'm leaving this wiki, but not cause of you. It was nice getting to work with you, and thanks for being my friend, you were great co-editor to work with. Goodbye mate! -- ImperiexSeed, 11:47 PM, May 27th 2015


Hey! Could you meet me on chat? There's something I'd like to discuss with some users. Tysonjackson (talk) 01:24, May 29, 2015 (UTC)


Hey! I'm sorry I forgot I was still on there. No one ever came on so I went to get a shower and completely forgot. Just let me know whenever you're free and we can discuss it then. Tysonjackson (talk) 03:03, May 29, 2015 (UTC)


Hey TD5. Could you please unlock the Deities article? Thanks in advance. EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 02:12, June 1, 2015 (UTC)

Wiki Redesign[]

Staff member Grace mentioned that our Wiki's Main Page contains too many templates and offered to help redesign the Wiki. What do you say about that? RaghavD'"Look into my eyes. It’s where my demons hide" 14:37, June 1, 2015 (UTC)

Yes, TD5. RaghavD'"Look into my eyes. It’s where my demons hide" 17:07, June 1, 2015 (UTC)

That is not what I meant. According to one of the Wikia Staff member, the Main Page on our wiki, ( is a quite cluttered and she offered to redesign it. I messaged you to see if you have any objections to it. It is not regarding any article. Although, we will discuss the problems associated with the Power pages and clear the confusion once and for all. Why don't you leave a message on the pages' talk pages and let everyone know what's wrong with the current notion of powers. But do you have any objection to the Wiki undergoing a redesign? RaghavD'"Look into my eyes. It’s where my demons hide" 13:44, June 2, 2015 (UTC)

I'm glad that you raised that issue. We'll discuss with everyone, on the Wiki and come to a consensus on how to resolve the matter once and for all. RaghavD'"Look into my eyes. It’s where my demons hide" 15:29, June 3, 2015 (UTC)

To kick start things, why dont you leave a message on those pages. People will respond and you can discuss your ideas with them and see if you can convince them of your stance. RaghavD'"Look into my eyes. It’s where my demons hide" 12:58, June 4, 2015 (UTC) 


Just a question, does the past tense thing includes the entire wiki or are there exceptions?

XQueenOfHeartsx (talk) 19:27, June 1, 2015 (UTC)


Hey man, a dumb question but gotta ask it, are the comments of the cast members who assist the fan conventions valid in terms in what they tell might or will happen on the show? I was scrooling Twitter today and lots of fans are exited cause Mark Pellegrino said in today Purgatory Convention that Lucifer will be back in season 11, looking for an official source other than Pellegrino's word I also discovered that apparently Cole is also coming back with his own storyline, my source so far besides looking for "Lucifer Season 11" and "#PurCon" trends on Twitter is also this tweet from a fan ( Damon-Balthazar-Salvatore (talk) 23:54, June 6, 2015 (UTC)

Yeah, I meant it mostly in the latter case as if it can be taken seriously, I mean, I know that Twitter is not all trustable.Damon-Balthazar-Salvatore (talk) 00:24, June 7, 2015 (UTC)


You should probably lock God too. Something tells me that the anon will continue this as an edit war Gabriel456 (talk) 00:31, June 8, 2015 (UTC)

Comic-Con Blog[]

Hey Twilight Despair 5,

I just wanted to let you know that we posted a blog about Comic-Con on this Wiki-

Cheers, The PK (WallGuestbook) 21:01, June 16, 2015 (UTC)

Imperiex's bias against Sam, again[]

Sorry to bother you Twilight, but Imperiex is again trying to write his hatred of Sam into articles, not his blogs where it belongs, and as you told him to. Now he's actually trying to say "Sam isn't a hero don't you understand. Every character in the show gets, I get it, why don't you?". Trip391 (talk) 01:20, July 9, 2015 (UTC)

  • In addition, whenever he undoes my edit, he is not only adding his bias back into the article, but also removing numerous cleanup edits I made. Trip391 (talk) 01:24, July 9, 2015 (UTC)

OM-Flippin'-G! Just watch the show, everyone's all over Dean and is looked at as the hero, while Sam is just standing there at his side getting NONE of the recognition at all. Dean gets all the ladies, he gets along really well with children, he's the best hunter on the show, and Sam is just his shadow. Like I said before, just assuming that when Dean's thanked, Sam's just automatically included too without actually evaluating the situation and using body language or the tensity of the interaction to make the determination, IS bias. Dean was the only person to call Sam a hero for what he did in season five, and when Charlie addressed it, guess who got all the praise and the pat on the back: Dean, of course. Also, when the publisher was talking to them, she said how awesome Dean was, but when she got to Sam, she had nothing to say about him. Those are just a few examples of how Sam is regarded in the show. The definition for the word 'hero' is: 'a person, typically a man, who is admired or idealized for courage, outstanding achievements, or noble qualities,' and Sam is not admired or idealized by anyone for anything he does. Therefore, he is not a hero. -- ImperiexSeed, 9:31 PM, July 8th 2015

Then Dean is a hero in both senses, but the definition Google gives for it, is 'a person, typically a man, who is admired or idealized for courage, outstanding achievements, or noble qualities.' Sam is not the hero or protagonist of the show, Dean is. Dean's the bigshot and badass, whose centrally focused on throughout the series. Dean was the 'holy one of God' for Kripke's arc, and if you notice, God was actually demonstrating his wrath and anger to the evils of the world through Dean, when Dean is mercilessly and awfully butchering evil. Even God seems to favor Dean. No, as a demon, Dean had very little to no control of his actions and was controlled and steered by his innermost darkest, and vilest desires. And as they're portrayed in Supernatural, to say he could've controlled himself when he was a demon, is quite wrong. -- ImperiexSeed, 8:12 PM, July 9th 2015

Imperiex's bias still[]

Again, Imperiex is wantonly ignoring what you told him about keeping his bias in a blog. As an admin of this wiki, can you please take administrative action to make sure this wiki stays neutral, and not written from one person's hateful bias. This is the Supernatural wiki, not the "I hate Sam and Jared because Dean is the best wiki". Trip391 (talk) 00:57, July 10, 2015 (UTC)


Hi, I probably accidentaly removed Death from Omnipotence page. Thanks for correcting :)The Omnipotent One (talk) 19:38, July 18, 2015 (UTC)


TD5, as you know, Imperiex is spreading his Sam hatred all over the wikia, everytime he edits. As annoying and frustrating as it is, it is one thing when he fills blogs and talk pages with it, but he won't stop adding it to articles either. I think he has been given more than enough warnings, and has proven that he will not stop vandalizing the articles. Can you please give him a ban to show that his behavior and actions are not acceptable, and won't be tolerated? Thanks EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 18:59, July 27, 2015 (UTC)

TD5, I didn't post anything at all bias on any articles. On Charlie's page, I put a picture of Dean and her watching a movie, and on Krissy's template, I took off Winchester Family, and just put Dean, because she showed no interest or affiliation towards Sam at all in any of her appearances. Also, on Andrea's page, I said that she kissed Dean and thanked only him, because in the episode, she never thanked Sam. I've seen the ep many times, as it is one of my top favorite eps, and her exact words were: "You saved my son, I can't ask for more than that," after which she kissed Dean and thanked him. -- ImperiexSeed, 6:02 PM, July 27th 2015

  • On Charlie's page, there was no reason to change the picture except "Dean's the best character and hero of the show!" Additionally, the image was a bit off, and didn't look right on the page with Dean's mouth wide open, whereas the other image displayed Charlie in the Men of Letters Bunker's garage. If someone took a good screenshot of them watching movies and drinking beer, that could better fit in a relationship section or on their relationship page. On Krissy's page, there was no reason to remove the Winchester Family affiliation, because she was affiliated with the Winchesters (Sam makes up the other remaining part of the Winchester family, not just "the hero" Dean). And in Dead Water, before Andrea kisses Dean, she thanked both brothers, not just "the hero" Dean. However, Imperiex again refuses to see this because it has to do with "the worst character" Sam. Trip391 (talk) 22:56, July 27, 2015 (UTC)

You are correct, Trip391, Dean is the best character and Sam is the worst character (in all of fiction and literature). ;) Anyway, no she does not thank Sam. After she kisses the hero Dean, she thanks Dean and then they leave. Sam is not thanked anywhere in the conversation. -- ImperiexSeed, 7:00 PM, July 27th 2015

Hey TD5, I'm good, thanks for asking. I'm just annoyed by how much hate Imperiex is spewing over the wikia, which is leaking into the articles. This has been going on for a long while, and he refuses to stop vandalizing. Here are some of the bias changes that he has made to articles since he got back from "leaving the wikia".

Also, about the soul thing: When Dean was taking to Death, he asked him if he could "hack" the hell part of Sam's soul off. Death replied that a human soul isn't a "pie you can slice". He said that it cannot be broken, not even by a being as powerful as he. Yes, the word "broken" could mean "destroyed", but in the context of this conversation, it is clear that he means it can not be broken into separate pieces. A few examples of souls being destroyed is when Mary canceled out the Poltergeist with her own soul, destroying them both, and in season 7 when the ghost absorbed the power from other spirits, which destroyed them. EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 00:34, July 28, 2015 (UTC)

In the episode "Home", Missouri said "Your mom's spirit and the poltergeist's energy, they canceled each other out. Your mom destroyed herself going after that thing." I think she made it pretty clear that her soul was completely destroyed. Although, with the ghost in season 7, I think you are right. I think that he absorbed the soul altogether, even leaving the consciousness, like when angels and demons absorb souls. EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 01:36, July 28, 2015 (UTC)

In addition to spewing his Sam hate across the whole wikia, he has once against become paranoid about me "stalking him". After he commented on a blog, I also posted my views, and then he accused me of spitefully following his edits, and stalking him. When I confronted him of his paranoia, he said "screw off". EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 19:03, July 29, 2015 (UTC) @EmpyreanSmoke: Run to mamma, you little boy. -- ImperiexSeed, 3:11 PM, July 29th 2015

^More immaturity and harassment from ImperiexSeed; not suprised...Imperiex was once a good editor, and established user. Now all he does is vandalize articles with his hate, fill his blogs with it, and harass me with his paranoia. Please TD5, you've got to stop this. He has been given more than enough warnings, and continues his obnoxious behavior. Please, issue the year ban you warned him about, so the wikia can know some peace, and this madness can stop. EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 19:19, July 29, 2015 (UTC)

You are the only admin who has been active in over a month. I'm not sure what the statute of limitations are for inactivity, but I think you are able to make this decision without it being an abuse of power, as you are the only active admin. I think him continuously vandalizing pages and harnessing other users should be enough to issue the ban, but if you want to wait for him to do something over and beyond, that is your call. Just think about it though, it would be better for the state of the wikia. EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 19:36, July 29, 2015 (UTC)

Sorry, I didnt mean to sound like I was making your decisions, I was requesting that he be banned, and gave you the reasons/evidence as to why he should be banned, so you could make your own decision as to what to do. Yes, I agree that we need a neutral admin; one that does not make decisions based on bias. But I don't think that you banning him would be unneutral, as you would be doing it because he vandalized and harassed. Yes, admins should be active at least every week, and I still think that we have too little admins, especially with FTW and RagHavD being inactive for a long while. If they remain inactive, I think I will request my rights back; That is if you support them being returned. Again, I know that you created a consensus amongst the admins as to whether or not Imperiex should be banned, but they aren't active right now, so they aren't responding. How long will you wait for them to respond before you make your own decision? How about if they don't reply within a week, you take matters into your own hands, and make your call? I think that sounds fair. EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 20:04, July 29, 2015 (UTC)


Hey TD5. Sorry to bug you, I know this who scene Imperiex caused is taking up all our time, but could you please unlock the God page? There are some edits I'd like to make, and I don't think that the vandels will undo it again. If they do, you could lock it again or ban them. Thanks in advance! EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 04:11, July 28, 2015 (UTC)

Primordial Being[]

Yes, I understand that. I wasn't suggesting that we remove the term "Primordial Being" from the articles all together, I was just saying we shouldn't list it as their species in their info box. EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 18:56, July 29, 2015 (UTC)

Imperiex, yet again[]

This should clearly be enough Twilight: "Lol, no. You're a dipshi&". Trip391 (talk) 07:00, August 1, 2015 (UTC)

Really, you're gonna throw a fit over that? Wow, lol. We live in the U.S., I'm allowed to express myself; freedom of speech. -- ImperiexSeed, 3:03 AM, August 1st 2015

Just because you/we/they live in the US, doesn't mean you can just say whatever you want to people. :/ EternalLocket (talk) 07:28, August 1, 2015 (UTC)

Re:Just making sure[]

Yea, it was Imperiex's response here to my changing Crowley's status back to unknown, since Mark Sheppard was clearly messing with all the fans as a joke during the summer hiatus. I thought we should keep it at unknown until we see the episode in October, and it confirms Crowley's fate beyond Mark Sheppard's joke, but I guess that made me a "dipshit", according to Imperiex? As it turns out, Andrew Dabb slipped up and accidentally confirmed that not only will Crowley survive the events of the finale, but will also be seen in a whole new light, so my caution was valid. Trip391 (talk) 01:48, August 2, 2015 (UTC)


Hey TD5. I think you handled Imperiex's case very fairly. You didn't give him the year ban because he said that he would stop, but you did give him a two week ban for the things he had already done. I'm glad that all of this is done, and that ImperiexSeed didn't have a long term ban, because he is such an established user on this wikia. Like I mentioned before, with you as the only active admin, I was thinking about asking CalebChaim to return my administrator rights. I listened to what he said before, and realized that he was right. I had a lot of maturing to do, and needed to work on my judgment and confrontation. While I am still working on my confrontational skills (when I am getting upset), I really feel that I have matured since then, and have got a better stance on my judgment. I know that you gave me your full support last time I asked for my rights back, but I wanted to check up with you in case you have changed your stance. EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 06:35, August 2, 2015 (UTC)

Actually, ImperiexSeed gave me his support when I asked to get my admin rights back. The only person who was actually against it was RaghavD. If you still think I should wait, then I'll take your advice, but it shouldn't be because of Imperiex, because he was in favor of my rights being returned.

Also, it was heavily implied that humans were created through macro evolution. In "The Man Who Would be King", Castiel was talking about a fish that was crawling out of the water, and that he shouldn't kill it, because there were "big plans for that fish". It was implied that humans would be evolved from this fish. Also in "Reading is Fundemental", Castiel said that he thought it would be the neanderthals that evolved into humans, and he was surprised when it was the homosapians. EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 17:49, August 3, 2015 (UTC)


On Gods page it doesn't say that the creations are listed in order, so I think that we should just leave them the way they are. There isn't any evidence implying when Heaven was created, so I think leaving it the way it is would be the best choice. EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 00:57, August 11, 2015 (UTC)

Durant vs Duval[]

This guy from the Bloodlines backdoor pilot should be named "Julian Duval", but his article is at "Julian Durant", and Julian Duval redirects there. His sister, Violet, is listed on IMDB as "Violet Durant", even though "Durant" wasn't said in the episode. I tried to move it, but the redirect prevents me, so can you delete the Julian Duval redirect, and move Julian Durant there please. Trip391 (talk) 01:01, August 11, 2015 (UTC)

  • Thank you. I'll check/fix the redirects in a little while. 03:20, August 11, 2015 (UTC)

This User...[]

Can you do something about Thegallaghers33? He/She keeps messing with Max Miller, editing to make it look like Max was an archangel. and they continue to do this despite being undone several times.Gabriel456 (talk) 23:20, August 12, 2015 (UTC)

and now he vandalized Sam WinchesterGabriel456 (talk) 23:35, August 12, 2015 (UTC)

Thank you for helping out :) Gabriel456 (talk) 23:36, August 12, 2015 (UTC)

RFA page[]

Hey, TD5. How's it going? I set up an RFA a while back when I was thinking about befoming an admin again, and forgot that I made the page until now. Would you mind sharing your thoughts on the page when you can? Thanks so much. EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 00:05, September 18, 2015 (UTC)

Ok, thank you so much. I would appreciate it if you could add that to the RFA page, as that is where CalebChiam looks. Thanks again! EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 01:14, September 20, 2015 (UTC)

Thank you. By the way, you added your views of Imperiex's adminship on my RFA page instead of his. Just wanted to let you know. Have a nice evening. EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 01:14, September 20, 2015 (UTC)

Here is his RFA page. EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 01:37, September 20, 2015 (UTC)


Hey, man, do you mind also commenting on my RFA with what your stance is on if I should get admin rights or not? Thanks a lot! -- ImperiexSeed, 8:16 PM, September 19th 2015


Hey, your input here would be appreciated. Cheers. Calebchiam Talk 01:40, October 8, 2015 (UTC)

Edit War Leviathans vs. Archangels[]

Hey TD5, it seems we have no state of concensus regarding the question whether archangels can kill leviathans or leviathans can kill archangels. As the archangel pages are blocked for non-registered users, the edit war shifted to the invulnerability page, with ip users and me (as IP) involved. The weaknesses blog came to no general agreement, as Calebchiam declared that a consensus can't be made by majority. He collected almost all the arguments for further discussions here and seems to think, that we can achieve a general agreement. I think as long as the dispute is not resolved, we should let the Leviathan-archangel question open, adding on the archangel pages the possibility that leviathans can kill them and on the leviathan page the possibility that archangels can kill them. Lambda1 (talk) 19:20, October 8, 2015 (UTC)

Can you remove my contribution page? 12:26, October 12, 2015 (UTC)


Umm hey i just wanted to talk about few things about spn . So whenever you see this give a buzz however you can .

well me and my friend were writing a fan fic so i was hoping if you're interested in helping outKraverine (talk) 11:04, October 21, 2015 (UTC)Kraverine

Odin page[]

Hey TD5, somebody is constantly changing the language of the Odin page and adds powers not shown on the show. Could you please block this page for non registered users ? Btw, could you lower the protection level of the Lilith page ? Thanks ! Lambda1 (talk) 11:34, October 24, 2015 (UTC)

Rugaru page move[]

Can you delete the Rugaru redirect so that Rougaru can be moved back to Rugaru. It seems someone mistakenly moved it, despite the fact that all but one of the scripts where rugarus are talked about don't spell it that way. Also, is this page necessary? Trip391 (talk) 07:17, October 25, 2015 (UTC)

Hey Td5. Today I made some major changes. When you are avaiable, can you check? Thanks.-SeraphLucifer

Hey td5, can you check super strength page? I have been editing with examples, reasons but Abdelfadeel always undo it with no explanations. Thank you... SeraphLucifer (talk) 21:08, October 28, 2015 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Wikia Contributers[]

Hey TD5, many people are trolling wikia, changing language, deleting pages, removing confirmed informations etc. Please do something about it. Thanks SeraphLucifer (talk) 16:41, November 1, 2015 (UTC)SeraphLucifer He changed language of Odin page, dunno how many times. Also did some minor changes like removing Fred Jones pics, powers.

Can you check super-strength page? This person edits with no reason, quotes nor information. He is trying to edit, but undo every single work I am trying to do. He is also adding biased information and his language is offensive. (He even wrote omfg.)  Hey Td5can you check this user? He is adding false information, thanks.

Super Strength[]

Its been better to lock the page but can you undo the page? I can explain the reasons:

1-Dean overpowered Castiel in 10x22. Even if Castiel did not fight back, Dean easily overpowered him while Cas was grabing and holding him. Cain was so much stronger than Dean.

2-Only Dean hurt Tamiel while they were fighting with him. He wasn't even under the Mark's influence. Cain was much stronger than Dean. (Also Dean punched Cupid and nothing happened, he even hurt his own hand. Tamiel an elite angel felt the pain.)

3-Dean with First Blade punched and hurt Metatron while he was empowered by Angel Tablet, which granted him at least archangel level power. He was significantly stronger than Raphael and Gabriel at that time. Cain was easily able to hold Dean's fists even he was empowered by the Mark.

4-Its been explained that noone in the hell is match for Lilith. Cain was presumed dead or missed at that time. Azazel is definetely weaker than both. Please remove (with the possible exceptions) part.

Also its non-releated but you told me that Cain removed and transfered the mark from himself. He didn't. In 10x14 we saw that the Mark of Cain on his arm was activated when he hold the Blade. Also its been known that only another user can kill another user. Thanks for reading. SeraphLucifer (talk) 13:05, November 3, 2015 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Hey Td5, didn't you consider my opinions? I think Super Strength page needs that changes. Please reply, thank you. SeraphLucifer (talk) 17:50, November 6, 2015 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Mark of Cain[]

First of all, I'd like to ask you that, why we saw the Mark through Cain's hand were same as Dean's in 10x14? He also felt the Blade. There was even soundtrack for it. Also if Cain killed Dean without mark, he knew he'd be back because it would be simply useless. As I said only another bearer can kill another bearer. That's why it is written that the Blade might make mortal the user then kill. Nice argument tho! SeraphLucifer (talk) 18:39, November 3, 2015 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

First of all, the Mark Lucifer completely removed the Mark. Otherwise the Darkness wouldn't set free. The spell was freeing someone from the Mark. That's why they only needed Dean's DNA. If Cain was alive at that time, the Darkness won't be set free. I read about that on forums and most users share the same opinion with me. Of course that doesn't mean I am right but I believe he copied the Mark, not completely transfered it.


I am having problems with the user known as SeraphLucifer. He broke the three revert rule. He keeps adding non-cannon information. He keeps saying Archangels can kill knights of hell. He doesn't even say possibly, to imply they possibly can, yet leaving the possibility they can't. He is saying they can for certain even though we've never seen a knight of hell be killed by anything but the 1st blade. I've repeatedly warned him to stop and put my reasoning for it . He refuses and just undoes my edits without argument whatsoever. His only argument, was something along the lines of "In the lore it says the archangels could kill them."

There are two major problems with this argument.  The first being: the lore greatly differs from the show. For example Lucifer is a Cherub in the lore and Michael is a seraph. Yet, in the show, both are archangels. This is just one of many differences.

Number 2: Even if we do give him the benefit of the doubt, The Knights were created by the writers purely for plot. Their is absolutely no lore on The Knights whatsoever. So that's obviously a lie.

Please ban him as it is corrupting the wikia. Thank you. 22:33, November 12, 2015 (UTC)


So, I've tried to ask Mkr11282 to write in past tense, but they don't care or think they should, despite the policy listed here which says that character articles should be in the past tense. That's all well and good and people will get around to fixing them, and bringing them up to spec in regards to the policy. Mkr11282, however, is acting way too aggressively, constantly calling me the "Wise One" and saying that anyone who actually follows the wiki's policies are part of the "Wiki Gods committee". I've asked him to refrain from this as it is considered personal attacks and harassment, but his response was this. So not only does he continue with the personal attacks, but he said he will continue to rewrite articles into the present tense despite the policy. This kind of attitude is not in the spirit of wikis collaboration, directly goes against no personal attacks and harassment and is far from being civil. Trip391 (talk) 20:56, November 19, 2015 (UTC)

  • Your, and Trip391's, idea of the "spirit of wikis collaboration" is lost on me. It seems that this collaboration is only such as long as us unWise ones color within your lines. And nice 'Run-to-Daddy' play, Trip.

Mkr11282 (talk) 23:02, November 19, 2015 (UTC)

Awww, re dux[]

Don't write articles in present tense, except for like Power sections on characters. Continue to do so or make personal attacks against others will result in a block. Thank you and happy editing.Twilight Despair 5 (The God of Creation) (talk) 21:58, November 19, 2015 (UTC)

Now run to daddy is rude. Also MANY wikia write their series in past tense. As there is no point writing present for episodes change often, to the new one. So stop writing present tense or personal attack. Or get blocked. You had a warning and didn't stop. Further breaking policies that have been, in place before I was an admin will be resulted with a month long block. Thank you and happy editing.Twilight Despair 5 (The God of Creation) (talk) 23:49, November 19, 2015 (UTC)

I am so over the tense thing. Do what you want to do, luv, but don't tell me what to do. Please know that I will continue to do what i do, unless of course you Wiki Gods block me, which will actually prove my point(s). I have not made any personal attacks, just a couple of jokes; Wiki Gods are just sooo sensitive.  But, put me in the corner if it makes you feel superior-ly. Oh, and you're welcome, and happy ending to you, too.   Smooches. Mkr11282 (talk) 02:20, November 20, 2015 (UTC)

Private chat[]

Do you have a Facebook/Twitter account where we could talk privately? EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 04:12, November 22, 2015 (UTC)

Well, is here somewhere that we can talk privately? Because there is something I really need to talk to you about. EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 04:38, November 22, 2015 (UTC)


Can you tell us the latest in Empyrean's case? Also, can you please put your thoughts in on Lambda1's blog? 01:12, November 23, 2015 (UTC)

Unblock Empyrean.[]

Also, may you please unblock EmpyreanSmoke? Though he definitely deserves it, there isn't any consensus yet while he should be banned so you should probably keep him unbanned until then.


Hello TD5, the hell and heaven pages were vandalized by, could you block them for unregistered user ? 19:04, November 23, 2015 (UTC)


Well, there is no quota of admins we have to meet. We'll have to make do with the remaining admins. Or perhaps we'll have more if some users step up and decide to go through the process of an RfA. Calebchiam Talk 03:03, November 26, 2015 (UTC)

Yes, that's reasonable. Though as mentioned, we did establish that nothing from the Q&A was to be taken as canon anyway. Calebchiam Talk 03:19, November 26, 2015 (UTC)
Do add on to the discussion on the blog with your input though. Consensus can't be built if users abstain from the discussion. (: Calebchiam Talk 03:19, November 26, 2015 (UTC)


I'm very sorry for the way I talked to you. I was being very stubborn and harsh. Though I did feel you were biased, I had no right to say that. 00:54, December 2, 2015 (UTC)

Random categories anon[]

Hey, Twilight. For the past few days, this anon keeps adding random categories to pages that don't need them. Like adding the vampires category to the characters category, which would then mean all characters are vampires. Or that vampires are ghosts and even adding the :Category:Images by Seven Deadly Sins|"Images by Seven Deadly Sins" category to the category page. Simply locking the category pages might work, but there are a lot of categories they may try this with though. Trip391 (talk) 22:21, December 6, 2015 (UTC)

Azazel page is locked[]

It seems Azazel is still locked by Empryeansmoke, so can you unlock it, or correct the two incorrect Dwayne Tanner redirects to Duane Tanner. Trip391 (talk) 23:40, December 6, 2015 (UTC)

The same is true for the Lilith page. --Lambda1 (talk) 23:50, December 6, 2015 (UTC)
    • I saw you unlocked them Twilight, thank you. Trip391 (talk) 03:55, December 7, 2015 (UTC)

It's all Empyreansmoke's fault. He's so stubborn, I can't even.


What's the verdict on Emp? Also, we'll need another admin. Can we vote on it?

Please ban this user for corrupting the wikia[] SeraphLucifer (talk) 20:27, December 7, 2015 (UTC)SeraphLucifer


It would be better if you raise the protection level of certain pages because there are many acts of vandalism that could have been easily avoided.Kkapoios (talk) 21:04, December 7, 2015 (UTC)

Phoenix Page[]

Hey TD5, can you unlock that page? SeraphLucifer (talk) 21:33, December 7, 2015 (UTC)SeraphLucifer Why is it locked?

Hey TD5, still waiting for a reply. Also can you unlock locked pages such as Zeus and Super Strenght? Thanks. SeraphLucifer (talk) 22:14, December 8, 2015 (UTC)SeraphLucifer


This contributor is vandilising pages ,and once more i'm going to ask that the pages'  protection level is raised so that only registered users can edit.Kkapoios (talk) 16:35, December 11, 2015 (UTC)

Empryean's block[]

While Empryean is blocked for two months, he is ban evading with his IP address, (proof here, and likely with this proxy located nearby him as well Also, he was rewriting an article into present tense, and adding speculation to the article and trivia section (Calebciam has previously told him this should not be done). Trip391 (talk) 20:08, December 13, 2015 (UTC)

Hello, it's Darchangel 66. A user named ImperiexSeed keeps adding mean things about Sam to the pages, and apparently it isn't the first time he's done it. Another user said that he apologized for it before, but he only did it to trick the mods. Can you please stop him? Thank you.

I'm not trying to trick anyone. I'm only adding what the shows shows us. Go check my recentest edit to Dean's page, everything I said about Sam is true. You guys are the biases ones, not accepting what the show shows us. -- ImperiexSeed, 5:29 PM, January 1st 2016
Just ban imperiex he is a dumbass and shitting the wikia thank youu

Just wanted to say thank you for the welcome and will do :) Hope you have a great night :)  (Breakmydreams (talk) 09:37, January 4, 2016 (UTC)) 

Ban request.[]

Hey TD5 how are you? I just wanted to say that you should ban ImperiexSeed for spreading hate over Sam and bad language. One of the examples:!#comm-44456

SeraphLucifer (talk) 20:55, January 4, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

I'm totally within my wikia right to express my opinions on blogs. -- ImperiexSeed, 3:57 PM, January 4th 2016
 Here is a ss of what he said if he deletes the comment.
I don't care if anyone sees that, I'm not ashamed of what I'm saying. I'm simply speaking my mind. -- ImperiexSeed, 4:05 PM, January 4th 2016
Here is a false apology he gave while attempting gain admin rights --Kaestal (talk) 22:15, January 4, 2016 (UTC)
I know, and all I'm trying to do is accosting to you guys and tell you that this behavior is surely over! I apologize and am incredibly sorry for all the totally awful, horrible and repugnant things I've said about Sam, who I have an alacrity to say he is a kind, strong, and intelligent character who anyone should look up to. September 20, 2015 by ImperiexSeed

The user ImperiexSeed is still constantly posting about how he hates Sam. It has filled up the wikia feed, and is contaminating the wikia. He has even moved beyond the Sam hate and is now harassing a living breathing human, Jared Padelecki. To paraphrase him, he said "Jared should go suck donkey balls." This should not be allowed on the wikia, and it isn't the only thing he has said. Can you please kick him off of the wikia? I'm surprised it hasn't been done by now.

Thanks for your efforts TD5, he has been doing this for long and using offensive language. Have a nice day! SeraphLucifer (talk) 22:08, January 6, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Please protect my userpage so that only I can edit it[]

Please protect my userpage so that only I can edit it. -- ImperiexSeed, 10:07 PM, January 5th 2016

Stop having your pathetic headcanon first Seed--Kaestal (talk) 03:11, January 6, 2016 (UTC)

evidence mr admin impseed put his opinyons

Imperiex's Ban[]

That ban was stupid and flawed. The whole situation was. You know it was to 17:10, January 7, 2016 (UTC)

So ImperiexSeed is banned for a year simply because he put a biased comment (that wasn't even necessarily untrue to begin with) into an article, while, Empyrean, who literally flad out lied to this wikia (again) about being friends with a supernatural writer, and banned people who disagreed with his "official" blog, is only banned for two months? What kind of crap is that?

Also, you literally let that guy edit his user page without any consequences whatsoever. You sat there, as this guy broke policy rules, and started messing with people's user pages, and you did nothing. YOU DID NOTHING.


Imperiex had been doing his thing for awhile, and I acknowledged that what I did was stupid his multi year Sam rage was going on way too long. I outright admitted that if the admins want me banned I would accept it so if me not getting in trouble is that despicable then go ahead and ban me if it would satisfy you and the community. Kaestal (talk) 01:50, January 8, 2016 (UTC)

I think you may have missed my point... By quite some margin 14:55, January 8, 2016 (UTC)

You are, how do I put this, disgusted with how it all went down, or something correct?  The guy who I resonded to is just angry that I didn't get banned, which I would be accepting if the Admins do it. You think that the Imperiexseed ban was stupid and the situation was "flawed" even though he was warned multiple times to not add his opinions to articles and did so anyways. The only time that admins banned him was not when people asked, it was when he added his opinion to articles.Kaestal (talk) 15:18, January 8, 2016 (UTC)

I'm mad because He was banned for an entire year, while EmpyreanSmoke, who lied to the entire wikia, and banned people who didn't agree with his so called facts (THAT TURNED OUT TO BE A LIE) and didn't want to put them on the wikia, was only banned for two months. This also wasn't the first time trying to deceive the wikia.

Just because he was in the wrong, that doesn't mean you get to mess with his user page. That's like letting a guard getting away with beating up a prisoner. Everyone has rights. You can't just take someone's rights away simply because he broke a little rule. And the fact that you don't even get as much as a warning makes me sick.

I agree with your decision to ban Imperiex. But a year? IT IS NOT THAT SERIOUS. CALM DOWN.

And the fact that you don't even get as much as a warning, makes me sick.

Didn't get a warning huh? That is your problem? I did get a warning to stop, and if I contined I would more than likely be banned for doing something when the admins said to stop. Imperiexseed has been warned to stop putting Sam hate in the articles before and he did it anyway, despite the admins saying next time he would be banned, he did it knowing that. Kaestal (talk) 16:52, January 8, 2016 (UTC)

Ok. I did not know this. I apologize. However, my point still stands about EmpyreanSmoke.

Although he deserved it, I felt that a year was too harsh. It was a good thing that we did not delete Imperiex's blog. Maybe we could reduce the ban to a lighter one? But we need to add some other form of punishment too so that he never repeats it again. I still don't understand him. He always had a strong stand for anything he believes in; be it God/Death, Archangels/Leviathans or Dean/Sam. Although I believe that the time for him to change was long gone. RaghavD'"Look into my eyes. It’s where my demons hide" 17:34, January 8, 2016 (UTC)

I agree completely RaghavD. A year was not that serious. At most I'd give him a month to show him that actions have consequences. A year ban is a joke.

A month is too less. Anything between 3-4 months would be enough time. And why don't you sign up, anon? It will help us take you and your words seriously. RaghavD'"Look into my eyes. It’s where my demons hide" 17:46, January 8, 2016 (UTC)

Didn't Imperiex get banned for this exact same thing before? He clearly didn't learn his lesson before and just started this up again about 3 months after he said he would stop for good, I don't know if doing anything less than drastic would point it out to him that he needs to stop doing this. Kaestal (talk) 17:57, January 8, 2016 (UTC)

I believe that it's useless to even ban Imperiex because he wouldn't learn anything. He will bide his time after the ban expires and be at it again. But we can't ban anyone permanently just like that. That's why there should be an even stronger punishment like being banned on the entire Wikia. That would scare even the most stubborn abusers like Imperiex and Empyrean. RaghavD'"Look into my eyes. It’s where my demons hide" 18:05, January 8, 2016 (UTC)

Is there a way to prevent a user from editing certain pages? Kaestal (talk) 18:10, January 8, 2016 (UTC)

@TD5: Yeah. They get no more chances after this. We couldn't ban them on the entire Wikia network even if we wanted to. The Staff can do that. Imperiex has been known to harass users on other wikis too. 

@Kaestal: Admins can block pages if there are edit wars or vandalism. RaghavD'"Look into my eyes. It’s where my demons hide" 18:23, January 8, 2016 (UTC)

I think that a year ban is suitable for ImperiexSeed's behavior. He has been told countless times to stop, and had been given several warnings, but he blew right past them. His last ban obviously wasn't enough because he didn't learn anything, so I think that a year is sufficient to show him he can't do this stuff. Light bearer (talk) 23:02, January 8, 2016 (UTC)

Agreed, 3 months doesn't seem to be sufficient, I will bring this to the wikia community admin. He should be blocked on the whole wikia network for a year, as others said, he is also banished on other wikia's. 23:30, January 8, 2016 (UTC)

Can you unlock Photokinesis page?[]

Hey TD5, can you unlock the page? I have to edit something important. SeraphLucifer (talk) 01:11, January 8, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Thank you... SeraphLucifer (talk) 01:26, January 8, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

"kinesis" implies manipulation.  I don't recall any character actually manipulating the light they emit, or light in general, which is why I keep renaming the page Gabriel456 (talk) 01:27, January 8, 2016 (UTC)


I was wondering if you were available to chat.

Orion (T-B-C) 07:45, January 21, 2016 (UTC)

Simply put, it's about this wiki.

Orion (T-B-C) 20:12, January 21, 2016 (UTC)

I could, but I think it'd get cluttered by other users' comments. That's why I prefer the chat. It's not urgent, so don't worry about it.

Orion (T-B-C) 21:02, January 21, 2016 (UTC)

Though it's not urgent, I'd appreciate it if you'd let me know when you could chat.

Orion (T-B-C) 18:29, January 25, 2016 (UTC)

Can you look into this?[]

Hey Td5, I have to ask if you can check what thepsychofroggy's IP is? Some guys are wondering if they are Imperixseed which would mean he is avoiding his ban.Kaestal (talk) 12:39, January 22, 2016 (UTC)

Hey TD5, it Empyrean. I'm only here to confirm that Thepsychofroggy is indeed ImperiexSeed. He recently messaged me the exact same thing "Thepsychofroggy" posted on a blog the other day. He has also stated that he "agrees" with ImperiexSeed about hating Sam. Just wanted to let you know what he was doing. Goodbye and good luck.

IP addresses are only visible to Wikia Staff. I sent a message asking them to look into the issue. I will let everyone know as soon as they get back to me. RaghavD'"Look into my eyes. It’s where my demons hide" 07:24, January 23, 2016 (UTC)


I emailed Wikia Staff about the issue, and I just saw this reply. They are basically leaving it up to us, which I suspected they might do. They check IP addresses only when there is disruption. So what do we do? Wait and watch? RaghavD'"Look into my eyes. It’s where my demons hide" 16:18, January 25, 2016 (UTC)


Hi TD5, I am doing sort of a survey, I just want to know your opinions about my edits, if you could reply I'd be grateful. SeraphLucifer (talk) 18:01, January 25, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer


Hey TD5, can you unlock Famine page, I'd like to edit/correct some informations. SeraphLucifer (talk) 20:42, January 27, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

ola psycofroggy is imperiex confirmed plz ban this acc

I admit, I, Thepsychofroggy, am ImperiexSeed. But I haven't been hating on Sam and have improved my behavior, so please, let me be. -- Thepsychofroggy, 6:41 PM, January 28th 2016  

Even if he stops putting mean things about Sam you blocked him for a reason, and he shouldn't get a free pass. If you look down the line he has promised to stop a lot but always continues. He is trying to bypass his block, and admits to doing it. You need to block his new account and IP (probably for a longer time for trying to get around his ban.) Darchangel 66 'I the Light Beaer alone hold back the Darkness.' (talk) 23:57, January 29, 2016 (UTC)

Archangel Blades/Archangels[]

Can you warn Darchangel 66, he is adding his personal opinions on that articles, ignores both me and Trip391.  SeraphLucifer (talk) 20:43, February 1, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

  • He's also reverted 4 times on each page, and was previously warned about the three revert rule on God's article. Trip391 (talk) 20:51, February 1, 2016 (UTC)

(Don't erase my messages on other peoples discussion pages)- The angel Nithael said that an angel blade can destroy Lucifer in "Into the Mystic", but these users don't want to accept it and keep reverting it, even when it was almost outright stated. Also, they also reverted more than 3 times. Darchangel 66-The Light who subdues the Darkness (talk) 20:46, February 1, 2016 (UTC)

  • Actually, neither of us reverted your theory more than 3 times. As an administrator, Twilight, you have the responsibility to make sure the wiki is accurate, and does not state incorrect information and theories as canon fact. Additionally, the three revert rule should be followed, as people who want their theories added to the site will constantly keep adding them back in, regardless of whether they should or not. In this case, Darchangel undid SeraphLucifer and my removals of his theory 4 times on the archangel blade article, and 5 times on the archangel article, violating the three revert rule both times. Trip391 (talk) 21:07, February 1, 2016 (UTC)

Hand of God and Bible[]

I'm just going to copy this from Darchangel 66's talk page, because I think it explains the issue well:

What most articles have is a "Lore" section describing what the real-life counterpart for an object/character/species is. This is fine - it's explaining where it came from and highlights the differences between real-world lore and Supernatural lore. What was placed in the Hand of God article, however, is nothing of the sort. It was assuming the real-world Bible is the exact same as in Supernatural (not true), that it's 100% factually correct in the show (also not true), and that the writers created a plothole by claiming the Ark was destroyed in the Flood because it didn't exist then (again, not true; you'd think such a contradiction would set off alarms in Sam's brain). In short, it was contrary to canon.

Orion (T-B-C) 06:47, February 20, 2016 (UTC)

What Lucifer said was, "I didn't think any of them had survived the flood, let alone into the 20th century" (probably not 100% accurate, but you can check the episode if you'd like). Put in another way, he's saying "I thought they had all been destroyed in the flood; I didn't think they would even survive into the 20th century". This indicates every Hand was created before the flood. It's basic grammar.

Orion (T-B-C) 15:36, February 20, 2016 (UTC)

"I didn't think any had survived the flood" means they existed prior to the flood. And "I didn't think any had survived the flood" is just another way of saying "I thought they had all been destroyed in the flood". Again, it's basic grammar.

Orion (T-B-C) 16:01, February 20, 2016 (UTC)


Funny, I was on Imperiex's page reading about his ban. He can't edit his own talk page as you claimed. 15:55, February 22, 2016 (UTC)

No problem. TBH I thought you intentionally lied. But I'll take your word for it. 18:36, February 23, 2016 (UTC)

Hi! I swear I'm so bad at keeping track of passwords this must be my 11th wikia account! I've been editing for a while! The wikia is reliable while showing the people I've gotten to watch the show spoilers! (Because I let my demonic side take over once yes I'm a special child)

DeanIMeanSupernatural (talk) 23:35, March 9, 2016 (UTC)I've Already Forgotten My Username

Banshee Are Fairies[]

HI Twilight Despair 5, i have to say you in advance that i'm french and thus my english is not quite perfect (désolé d'avance).

I know that it is implied by Dean that Banshee are fairies, but as he says himself it's in the fairy lore, and that maybe there is a fairy version of the banshee (the version seen in the episode will be so a monster). In addition, the Banshee seen in the episode, possess a lot of traits from the monsters (fang, feeding on human). Ok you will tel me that a monster will not possessed telekinesis and intangibility who reminds spirit-species, but the Shojo, a creature from Season 7, is said to be a monster by the wiki, but despite this, possesse spirit-like powers like invisibility or teleportation (just like banshee). Also the fact that the banshees had a similar face to the Wicked Witch could be a prove that they are a malevolent kind of fairy (maybe even the Fairy Devil).

Genesis 1[]

The user Blaziken RJCF keeps removing a piece of trivia on the Darkness's page. Before season 11 Andrew Dab described the Darkness by referencing the first day of creation "there was the darkness and then there was light". In the trivia it says that the war between God and the Darkness could fit the first day of creation (metaphorically of course), but Blaziken RJCF keeps removing him because it isn't literal enough for him. Darchangel 66-The Light who subdues the Darkness (talk) 22:16, March 13, 2016 (UTC)

Amara and the Bible[]

A user and I are having a disagreement over whether or not Amara fits in with the first day of creation in Genesis.

The first day of Genesis is God separating the light from the darkness; this is true. However, it speaks of him then calling the darkness "night" and the light "day". The first day of creation in Genesis is, in fact, God creating the day and night. Whereas Amara was imprisoned, the first day of creation in Genesis describes the passage of time (day-evening-night-morning) when it comes to the first day.

This is my reasoning for removing the piece of trivia that states the battle between God and Amara "seems to fit in" with Genesis. Because Genesis describes the creation of day and night (with the darkness being the night), and not something even close to the series' lore.

With that in mind, I defer to your judgement.

Orion (T-B-C) 22:23, March 13, 2016 (UTC)

Genesis also says that the Mark of Cain was given to Cain by God. This doesn't fit Supernaturals lore. You have got to remember that in the Supernatural universe the Bible gets more wrong than it does right. You also have to remember that there are symbolic meanings behind things in the bible and not everything is literal. Obviously in real life the darkness is suppose to literally mean the night, but in Supernatural with an entity like the Darkness who was sealed away by God at the very beginning, that very much fits God separating the light from the Darkness on day one. Especially when you take into account what the writers say about the Darkness. Darchangel 66-The Light who subdues the Darkness (talk) 22:29, March 13, 2016 (UTC)

In the Bible, the darkness is nothing but the night. It's not imprisoned, and is, in fact, a key component of the day/night cycle. Throughout the six days of creation, the Bible describes the day/night cycle. There's a big difference between interpreting the six days to fit Supernatural lore and making a direct comparison with other entities and concepts in different religions. There's also a big difference between the Bible getting something wrong (Lucifer gave Cain the Mark) and something simply not being in the Bible at all (the "terrible war" between God and his sister, which is nothing more than God creating day and night). And then there's Dean's statement: "So Genesis is a lie? Shocker". Death also corroborates this view by saying the "Sunday school teachers" teach something that's false. Something based on Genesis, if I might add.

Orion (T-B-C) 22:37, March 13, 2016 (UTC)

My point is that the war between God and Amara is not similar to anything in the Bible. The darkness in the Bible is just the night. It's not evil, it's not destructive; it's nothing but the end of each and every day. Its separation from the light is just to create the day/night cycle, and nothing more. How does "God saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness." and "God called the light day, and the darkness He called night. And there was evening and there was morning, one day." even remotely resemble a "terrible war"?

Orion (T-B-C) 23:40, March 13, 2016 (UTC)

What I said was that I would defer to your judgement; not that I wanted to defer to your judgement. As far as I can tell, your judgement is based on a need to fit the Bible in every single God-related article. Many religious people seem to share this; it's why God's article (just one of many) was stuffed with real-world lore for a very long time (mostly in his "Powers and Abilities" section, which used to describe him as an omnimax deity, even though that was never established, and some of it outright contradicted canon), rather than canon. It's why several articles are regularly vandalized by people who can't seem to accept that these are fictional characters in a TV show, and not actual deities. And it's why I don't want to defer to your judgement. Because you have no basis for saying that Genesis resembles the "terrible war" between The Darkness, God, and the Archangels.

You can say the first day of creation in Genesis fits with the "terrible war" Death spoke of, but the fact remains, the first day of creation in Genesis is just God creating day and night. The only way you can say "God called the light "day," and the darkness he called "night." And there was evening, and there was morning--the first day." (Genesis 1:5) resembles "God and the archangels sealed the Darkness away" is if you twist the Bible's words to the point of being unrecognizable. Here's the message I put on Darchangel 66's talk page:

"The Bible makes no reference to entities similar to Amara. She is an all-consuming evil force. The Bible refers to God separating the light and darkness to create day and night (Genesis 1:5 - God called the light "day," and the darkness he called "night." And there was evening, and there was morning--the first day). It also says he created Heaven and Earth prior to the darkness even existing (Genesis 1:1 - In the beginning, God created the heavens and the Earth). The Bible also says God was the first being in existence (John 1:1 - In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God). No other entity to speak of. This is what happens when you try to conflate the Bible with Supernatural lore. It doesn't work because they're not the same; not without, as I put it, considerable twisting.

Other religions, however, speak of an Amara-esque entity; an actual, living being that's all-consuming and existed before everything else."

With that, I hope you'll read the first chapter of Genesis, so you can verify that I am, indeed, correct about what it says, and that Amara's battle with her brother and his first creations don't fit the Bible.

Orion (T-B-C) 22:57, March 26, 2016 (UTC)


Hey TD5 I hope your doing okay, can you lock the Gabriel page? ĞeoPeople refuse to believe he is dead. Thanks... SeraphLucifer (talk) 20:32, March 22, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Thanks for replying, I'd like to mention that Mark Sheppard also confirm that Crowley was dead for certain pre s11, and Lucifer confirmed that Gabriel is dead in 11x10.  SeraphLucifer (talk) 20:44, March 22, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Could the Gabriel article be unlocked for some changes not relating to issues of debate?

Jdogno7 (talk) 06:38, April 12, 2016 (UTC)


I'm not entirely convinced. Amara is destructive - it's literally one of her defining characteristics - and Lucifer already said she was "determined to take over everything". If there was nothing to take over before God created the Archangels, this statement would be downright bizarre (note that Lucifer had no reason to lie in this instance, as saying that wouldn't make Sam more likely to say "Yes").

From the available information, I gather that God created stuff (with considerable effort, as per Metatron's statement), and Amara either destroyed his creations or consumed them (as per Lucifer's statement and her allusion to her long-term plan to become one with everything). Then, God just locked her away, so he could create in peace without her ripping everything to shreds.

That said, I must admit your hypothesis explains why she was so weak at first. Even being locked away for billions of years shouldn't have been enough to drain her to the point of being weaker than a demon (a powerful demon, but a demon nonetheless).

Orion (T-B-C) 23:09, March 26, 2016 (UTC)

While claiming I'm interpreting the facts to suit my conclusion, you've conveniently ignored the facts themselves. Lucifer stated she wanted to "take over everything", and Death credited her as a "horribly destructive, amoral force". You can't "take over everything" if there's nothing to take over, nor can you destroy if there's nothing to destroy. God created something before the Archangels; before his war with his sister. Something she destroyed and/or attempted to take over. This shows that God has the power to create things on his own, without using his sister. Even ignoring all that, the fact he created the Archangels is a testament to his ability to create independently of Amara.

And yeah, I was asking you to protect those articles from anonymous editing. Although the vandalism is easily undone, all that means is that we (contributors) would have to constantly monitor them.

Orion (T-B-C) 23:36, March 26, 2016 (UTC)

The sacrifice could just be locking her away so she wouldn't obliterate everything, like he did with the Leviathans. How would he even siphon her power, when the Mark had been handed to Lucifer for safekeeping?

Alright, thanks for locking the articles.

Orion (T-B-C) 23:56, March 26, 2016 (UTC)

Locking Sam, Dean, and Castiel's articles, and any relationship articles related to them[]

These particular articles are being targeted for regular vandalism by anonymous editors who seem to be too lazy to create their own (fan fiction) wikis. Preventing such edits is probably for the best.

Orion (T-B-C) 23:12, March 26, 2016 (UTC)

Hey TD5[]

Hey TD5, can you block the user ArchangelRaphael? He always add non canon information and now he is removing information from Gabriel page. He doesn't even argue or give any statement. Thank you... SeraphLucifer (talk) 13:25, March 31, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Thank you for warning him, I know I am being offensive but all I want is to organize the wikia with true, confirmed and canon informations. Also please lock the Gabriel page for everyone. Thats all I can say for now, thank you... SeraphLucifer (talk) 14:03, April 1, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Ehm, thanks for protecting the page but before the protection, Archangel Raphael changed info, can you undo it please? SeraphLucifer (talk) 22:31, April 2, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Could the Gabriel article be unlocked for some changes not relating to issues of debate? Jdogno7 (talk) 06:38, April 12, 2016 (UTC)

Edit War[]

If you could lock the pages relating to Michael and Lucifer's relation towards one another that would be great.

Blaze is jumping the gun due to a single sentence made an untrustworthy source and taking it as the irrefutable truth. Until we have more information than one person's claims it should remain admin only. Kaestal (talk) 08:58, April 8, 2016 (UTC)


I'm the wikia contributor who is chanching the wikia page on the musics. I was to lazy to connect myself.

Thank you for your message :)

SatanIsCute (talk) 08:15, April 9, 2016 (UTC)

Hey Twilight, can you do something about this anon? He/She keeps altering pages with vandalism (i.e, saying Libby is a primordial being, Todd is Ares, etc) Gabriel456 (talk) 15:46, April 9, 2016 (UTC)

Lucifer's Page[]

Hello Twilight Despair 5, I get why you locked the Lucifer page, which was the smart thing to do, but you shouldn't have left the "first son" information on there. Every user except for Blaziken wants the information off the page until the show confirms that what Amara said was literal. The wikia policy says that in situations like this, the page should be reverted to the state it was in before the disagreement broke out. The Lucifer page should say he is the second Archangel, as that is what it said before the edit war. This is how it should remain until the show answers it. Darchangel 66-The Light who subdues the Darkness (talk) 19:50, April 10, 2016 (UTC)

For the record, I'm not the only one who agrees that her statement was literal, as evidenced by other users editing to that effect. I'm not even the first to do so. I'm just the most vocal.
Orion (T-B-C) 20:38, April 10, 2016 (UTC)


This user has insulted me on Lucifer's talk page (direct link to the edit) and Kajune's blog concerning Amara's statement about Lucifer (direct link to the comment). I want to note that despite my defense of the idea of a retcon, I never insulted anyone.

Orion (T-B-C) 04:17, April 14, 2016 (UTC)


Hey, Twilight, it's EmpyreanSmoke. I know I'm not suppose to be on here, but I'm not here to edit. ImperiexSeed is avoiding his ban again, using the account "Thescarypea". If you look at his contributions, the first page he ever edited on was about me losing my admin rights. From then on out he really only posted on my wikia political blogs. Now "Thescarypea" is making the EXACT same argument about "The capital "G" in God carrying baggage of omnipotence, omniscience, and omnipresence". He uses the EXACT same wording. Please ban his new account so he doesn't get around his current ban.


Hey TD5, this user constantly adds non related things to witch page and use non-canon things about witches, can you warn him, since he doesn't listen to anyone. Thanks... SeraphLucifer (talk) 22:27, April 22, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Ehm, thanks for warning but still he keeps doing that. SeraphLucifer (talk) 17:12, April 24, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Can you please just ban him? It's getting extremely annoying! He keeps ignoring any and all comments towards him and does whatever he damn well pleases. A ban should be in order, and I'm tired of undoing his crap, and I'm sure SeraphLucifer is too. Gabriel456 (talk) 16:21, April 25, 2016 (UTC)

Indeed... SeraphLucifer (talk) 17:13, April 25, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Re: Knights of Hell[]

Hey TD5, hope you are okay, I don't know if Cain created the Knights through the Mark, is there a statement for it? As I know he only created/founded the order. SeraphLucifer (talk) 20:28, April 25, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

I meant that I hope your life's going well... Good wishes shortly. SeraphLucifer (talk) 20:35, April 25, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer


Also, I have a question, do you know why other admins are offline usually? I only see you around here and maybe FTWinchester and Caleb rarely. How many admins do we have in this wikia, as I know you, Caleb, FTW, Radhavg are the only admins. Since we deal with many trolls, we need admins to check the wikia. SeraphLucifer (talk) 20:41, April 25, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

No, no I don't want to be an admin, I just say that we need admins to be online. SeraphLucifer (talk) 04:48, April 28, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer


Hey TD5, hope you are doing fine, NoahAquarius is avoiding his ban and by using another account named "Qetsiyah Bennett." Please ban him because he is obssessed with witches and corrupting the pages for a long time. I'll try to fix the witch page, after that if you could lock it, I'd be grateful. SeraphLucifer (talk) 20:19, May 5, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Yup, it's definitely him. See here. He undid this edit less than a minute later, as per his usual MO.

Orion (T-B-C) 20:23, May 11, 2016 (UTC)

God's sexual orientation[]

Given the amount of vandalism as of late by people who don't know what sexual orientation is, I recommend you lock God's article to prevent edits by anonymous editors.

Orion (T-B-C) 11:43, May 7, 2016 (UTC)

I hope I'm not out of line here, but you may also want to get more admins, or at least get the current ones to be more active. I've been locked in an edit war with a lunatic for the better part of an hour now.

Orion (T-B-C) 13:58, May 7, 2016 (UTC)

Then you should get new ones. An administrator who doesn't administrate is useless.

Orion (T-B-C) 18:33, May 7, 2016 (UTC)

Regardless, you can't deny this wiki needs at least one more active admin. You're the only active admin I see around here. I recommend you request Bureaucrat rights, or ask the current bureaucrat to promote someone.

Orion (T-B-C) 18:53, May 7, 2016 (UTC)

Re Admin Nomination[]

I know TD5, you are the only admin who is around here. Everyone has job to do, I understand. Always appreciated your efforts. SeraphLucifer (talk) 05:15, May 10, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Darth Kieduss the Wise[]

This user is constantly and purposefully adding grammatical errors to articles, as seen here, here, and here. To be clear, I'm referring to his capitalization of pronouns in the middle of sentences, which is inarguably wrong from a grammatical perspective. It's grammar 101, really - only proper nouns and the personal pronoun "I" are capitalized in the middle of sentences.

Orion (T-B-C) 13:17, May 10, 2016 (UTC)

The Darkness page[]

Hey TD5, how are you ? I recognized that you locked the Darkness page. Is it appropriate to lock the page for everyone because one user didn't follow the protocol in case of disagreements (As he was supposed to shift the discussion over to the talk page) ? Once he broke the three revert rule, you could have just banned him for some days. As a new episode is about to air tonight, It would be great if you would unlock the page to allow keeping the wiki up to date. Lambda1 (talk) 15:58, May 11, 2016 (UTC)

God and Michael[]

Hey TD5, can you unlock these pages please? SeraphLucifer (talk) 19:07, May 15, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer


Hey TD5, that paragraph contains many wrong info. 

While God is techincally a deity, his magic falls under a different type than the pagan gods. His magic is completely independent of tribute. Unlike how the pagans were greatly stronger when given tributes. Amara God's sister has a similar power. Enabling her's fog to awaken a Prophet of the Lord.

Firstly God is no deity, we have to delete that part an rearrange it.

Also ban this user for corrupting the wikia, thanks. SeraphLucifer (talk) 09:45, May 16, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Firstly, God's species isn't deity. He's been put in categories, deitiy by people, because they worship him. That is why we have to change it. He is the creator of life. He is being as stated. SeraphLucifer (talk) 14:49, May 16, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Hey, also what do you think about recent changes in Zachariah, Seraphim page? SeraphLucifer (talk) 16:52, May 16, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer


Hey TD5, I want to apply for an adminship. What should I do? SeraphLucifer (talk) 16:18, May 18, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer


This user keeps removing canon information and vandalized my talk page, even though I explained to him why he was wrong.

Orion (T-B-C) 21:25, May 18, 2016 (UTC)

He's back at it under an IP address.

Orion (T-B-C) 11:10, May 20, 2016 (UTC)

Hey, ive got a question, alot of pages on here are really old, like, in the Lucifer page, it says he is one of the only five things the colt cant kill, and that cant be right, it probably cant kill any of the archangels, it cant kill god, and it cant kill Amara, aka the Darkness, so that makes 6 right there that it cant kill, so yeah, and on alot of the old monster pages, it says nothing in the weaknesses about things like, Death's Scythe, or god, so yeah, sorry for the trouble.


Hey TD5, can you lock the page? Users keep harrasing it. Thanks. SeraphLucifer (talk) 19:15, May 21, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Death and the natural order[]

To be bound by something means that one cannot break it. Consequences exist for any action. If Death were bound by the natural order, he wouldn't be able to resurrect people or kill them before their time. Furthermore, there were improvements to that page that go well beyond one simple sentence that you could have added back without reverting everything.

Orion (T-B-C) 16:34, May 30, 2016 (UTC)

Breaking the natural order has consequences. This is true. However, how does this validate your claim that Death, etc., are bound by it? All it means is that breaking the natural order has consequences, which we already know. I just don't see how you go from "When the natural order is broken, chaos ensues" to "Death is bound by the natural order". As far as I can tell, the two are not equivalent, or even related. If Death were bound by the natural order, he would never resurrect people or kill them before their time, but he has done so out of sheer annoyance or convenience (in other words, he did it because he wanted to).

Orion (T-B-C) 16:46, May 30, 2016 (UTC)

He actually did that when he gave his ring to Dean. He stopped doing his job and put someone else on it, and he did it on a whim. He just wanted Dean to see the damage breaking the natural order causes.

Orion (T-B-C) 17:03, May 30, 2016 (UTC)

Yes, problems can happen if Reapers don't do their job. However, you've yet to explain how, exactly, that means that they're bound by their job. As far as I can tell, those two statements are not related. How do you go from "Chaos ensues" to "Death is bound by his job"? Are you telling me Reapers can't cause chaos if they want to?

Orion (T-B-C) 05:36, May 31, 2016 (UTC)

A user on The Natural Order talk page agrees with me. You go by consensus here, right? Maybe we should stick to the talk page, like you were doing.

Orion (T-B-C) 23:02, May 31, 2016 (UTC)

I know two people don't make consensus. That's why I'm suggesting we move this discussion to the article's talk page.

Orion (T-B-C) 07:25, June 1, 2016 (UTC)


This user keeps inserting false information into God's article. We know God is not supremely powerful, as Amara is even more powerful than he is. I've addressed the user in edit summaries, but he/she doesn't react and keeps putting false information.

Orion (T-B-C) 23:01, May 31, 2016 (UTC)

God is not supremely powerful. A supremely powerful being is the pinnacle of power (hence "supremely" powerful). That's false information.

Orion (T-B-C) 07:17, June 1, 2016 (UTC)

Amara surpasses him. We know this to be true. It's been stated and demonstrated in the series. God is on the same level as Death, and Amara surpasses them both.

Orion (T-B-C) 13:07, June 1, 2016 (UTC)

...I have no idea what you just said, except the last sentence, which contradicts the lore: Amara is more powerful than God. He's not on her league, at all.

Orion (T-B-C) 14:47, June 1, 2016 (UTC)

Amara overpowered him after being weakened by a combined attack from Witches, Demons, and Angels, plus Lucifer's spear. She also overpowered Lucifer at the same time, and neither of them could do anything about it.

Furthermore, the "a" in "a powerful primordial being" isn't there for comparison, but for description. It's like saying Crowley is a powerful demon. It isn't there to imply that there are other powerful demons, but to say that Crowley is powerful, as well as being demonic in nature. Equivalently, "God is a powerful primordial being" is there to say that he's powerful and of the primordial being persuasion, rather than "God is one of several powerful primordial beings".

Orion (T-B-C) 15:20, June 1, 2016 (UTC)

You can say they have similar influence over the natural order, but that's not what the sentence refers to. That's why it's false information: because God is not "supremely powerful". He's just powerful.

Orion (T-B-C) 16:09, June 1, 2016 (UTC)

In that case, I think this edit shows exactly what he's after: conflating God with God.

Orion (T-B-C) 16:56, June 1, 2016 (UTC)

I agree with Blaziken, again. The edits of MoS are not compliant to the in-universe lore, he's obviously religious, and feels its his duty to force the belief that the Judeo-Christian God, is the the Supernatural God. They are not the same, he needs to realize that, because claiming Supernaturals version of god is "Supremely" powerful, is vandalism. Supremely literally means superior to all others, and the SPN God required help to defeat, The Darkness. Thereby disproving that part of his edits. If one of you explains this to him perhaps he will stop, I would explain it to him if I had the right, but i'm not part of this wiki's management.

Zane T 69 (talk) 17:28, June 1, 2016 (UTC)

By saying he is "a supremely powerful" anything is a lie, at least for the SPN God. But perhaps, you have grounds for a temporary block, he completely disregards the chronology of Supernatural, and puts biblical info into articles, and edits with bias. Which compromises the integrity of the articles, by putting lies into them. With your permission I would talk with him, try to make him understand, I wouldn't try offending his beliefs of course. Zane T 69 (talk) 18:08, June 1, 2016 (UTC)

That is basically what i'm saying, God required help to beat Amara, she was able to nearly kill him after being weakened by a series of attack. There can only be one supreme being, because by definition to be supreme, you have to be superior to all others. Which doesn't apply to any being in the SPN universe, other wise they could destroy all opposition, even when outnumbered. In short i'm saying no being in the SPN universe is truly supreme. That all beings just have varying scales of power, which in my opinion is Amara, then God, and Death, in order of greatest to, least power. The power ratings are just my opinion though. 

But I will talk to him, try to make him understand. Zane T 69 (talk) 18:26, June 1, 2016 (UTC)

I understand what your saying now. Your saying Amara, God, and Death share the top tier with similar, but not exactly equal, levels of power. I agree, I just thought we were debating whos the absolute supreme being.

So they represent a "Supreme Tier" at the top, with other assorted beings below them. I want to apologize for misunderstanding that, the supreme court comparison clarified it for me.

Apology Gift  I believe this will help you get more space on your talk page. It tells you how to archive past messages. Zane T 69 (talk) 18:53, June 1, 2016 (UTC)

Can you meet me in the chat?[]

I have a proposal to make, but it requires that only admins know about it.

Orion (T-B-C) 18:48, June 1, 2016 (UTC)


This user keeps uploading videos to advertise his Youtube channel.

Orion (T-B-C) 14:25, June 4, 2016 (UTC) forgot how to link pages.

That person is spamming, and creating a junk page that needs to be deleted. Actually the category for speedy deletion needs to be cleaned out, unless you think some of the pages can be used. The power tiers one might be useful. Zane T 69 (talk) 22:53, June 4, 2016 (UTC)

Another vandal:

We really need to restrict editing to, registered users. I found out how, if you want the info. Post on my wall. Zane T 69 (talk) 02:01, June 12, 2016 (UTC)

This: user vandalized the Demon Summoning page. Evidence:   Zane T 69 (talk) 21:38, June 15, 2016 (UTC)

This: user vandalized the Flagstaff page. Evidence:  Zane T 69 (talk) 00:27, June 16, 2016 (UTC)


This user keeps removing canon information about Death's death. I've left a message, but he has neither replied nor stopped.

Orion (T-B-C) 18:34, June 19, 2016 (UTC)

After I was rude to him (in response to him doing the same), he finally provided a link confirming what he said:

In that clip, Julian Richings says he'll be back on the show.

Orion (T-B-C) 19:20, June 19, 2016 (UTC)

It does take several listens before you can understand what he's saying.

I want you to do what you think is right.

Orion (T-B-C) 19:50, June 19, 2016 (UTC)


This user is yet another spammer/advertiser. He uploaded a video and filled it with a long BS description about subscribing to his channel.

Orion (T-B-C) 15:37, June 24, 2016 (UTC)


Another dipshit Destiel vandal.

Orion (T-B-C) 08:41, July 1, 2016 (UTC)


Hey TD5, if you could leave your comments here , I'd be thankful. SeraphLucifer (talk) 09:06, July 1, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Someone is advertising a phone number. page and User.Zane T 69 (talk) 20:36, July 1, 2016 (UTC)

I don't know the person, but you or another admin blocked the dude. Also, have you considered archiving your talkpage? Zane T 69 (talk) 23:38, July 1, 2016 (UTC)


Hey TD5, this user keeps vandalize and insert wrong information on God, invulnerability pages. SeraphLucifer (talk) 08:18, July 2, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer‎[]

Another religious fanatic vandal.

Orion (T-B-C) 11:07, July 2, 2016 (UTC)‎

Re: Bans and Blocks[]

I think you're being too harsh on handing out bans, TD5. I mean, one year for just 2 instances of vandalism? As much as I hate Destiel spam or any vandalism of that sort, I think a week at most would suffice before we start dealing more severe punishment. Just a thought. FTWinchester (talk) 22:22, July 2, 2016 (UTC)

I understand it becomes annoying when they still do it. Still, let's err on the side of caution. If they keep doing it, then by all means, let's drop the banhammer hard and fast. FTWinchester (talk) 23:07, July 2, 2016 (UTC)

First issue.[]

I discovered I can't edit the "on the wiki" tab, and post a list of staff, a place to report and add a link to the policies. So I propose the creation of a page called the Admin Noticeboard which we can create links too, at the top of our talkpages. Its not my first choice, but it'll work. Opinions? Zane T 69 (talk) 03:54, July 3, 2016 (UTC)

Do you have experience editing the MediaWiki:Common.js? I ask, because I looked it over, to try installing the "LockOldBlogs", which Caleb approved. I was wondering if you could install it? I looked over the code and couldn't figure out where to put in the new code. Zane T 69 (talk) 19:57, November 4, 2016 (UTC)

Wiki Navigation[]

Hey TD5, I made some changes on wiki navigation, what do you think? SeraphLucifer (talk) 06:15, July 20, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Well, I'll see what I can do about the Magic Page. SeraphLucifer (talk) 14:49, July 20, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Hi - Re: edit on Castiel's handprint, scars are usually after effects, no? seems redundant to me.Reka12452 (talk) 17:55, September 7, 2016 (UTC)

Okay. It was a miscommunication. I suggest we get a good nights sleep and talk tomorrow when calmer. If you can, please respond within 11 minutes I gotta go soon. Zane T 69 (talk) 03:48, November 5, 2016 (UTC)

I agree, the debate got heated. It was all of our faults, please see my latest post on Magda page. Zane T 69 (talk) 03:58, November 5, 2016 (UTC)
I also, Apologize too. I agreed, but I forgot to apologize. Zane T 69 (talk) 04:00, November 5, 2016 (UTC)
Glad you guys could work it out. Calebchiam Talk 02:51, November 6, 2016 (UTC)

Hi, thanks for the welcome.

I would like to know (since we're 4 episodes in) when will the link to the page appear at the top (under a name like the others). Do you understand what I mean? I find it easier to go there and go to (i.e. season 3) and from there read the whole episodes in the season &/or find a character I need to/want to read about (i.e. Zachariah) (especially if I can't remember the name of the character.)

I find it tiring to do the research with season 12. I need to go to season 11 and from there (at the bottom of the poster for the season, find "season 12" to read about the episodes that are going to come in this month.

Sorry if creating this shortcut troubles you &/or other members of the wikia. Since I'm not sure if I can do it myself (plus, I had trouble trying to do it when I tried it in my personal blog, I'm not confident enough that it's going to be like and function as the ones already in the wikia.)

Thanks in advance.  Megstiel24 (talk) 02:50, November 6, 2016 (UTC)

Advertising forum for background and logo change.[]

Please register your opinion here: link. Zane T 69 (talk) 15:41, November 7, 2016 (UTC)

I also had to update the Wiki Navigation/header. The demand was building and I saw a way to give the community what it needed and wanted. Zane T 69 (talk) 18:48, November 9, 2016 (UTC)

Need a favor[]

I'd love if you can help me to restore the default signature. I wanted to have a personalized signature but I was unable to make it work. 

Since I have the ability to create a page but I can't delete said page, I want you to help me to delete it. Here it is:

Thanks in advance

Megstiel24 01:58, November 8, 2016 (UTC)

I was able to restore the signature but still would love to erase that page that didn't help with the intention of creating a personalized signature Megstiel24 (talk) 02:06, November 8, 2016 (UTC)

Okay, as I have a lot to do today. I'll try solve this matter in one reply. Whether it is TK or BK would be largely speculation, we cannot truly say which one it is. As a compromise we could say, Biokinetic (BK) feats. "Could be an advanced application of Telekinesis (TK)."

"But Biokinesis shouldn't list rudimentary tossing someone in a wall" I agree. "or making them cough blood." I disagree, this seems like Biokinesis to me. Or we could say the TK use is essentially Biokinesis.

"As in this series, it's not so separate each power. It's more of different uses of their power where it comes from Grace, Demon Juice, God Power and so on." You could be right, but that's unconfirmed information and therefore speculation. Putting that in an article would hinder our reputation as s factual resource.

"Example Fred Jones Sam said this. "Fred's got juice I mean an average psychokinetic can move things with his mind, but a guy like Fred, you get him worked up, he can reshape reality." This sounds like Telekinesis is the foundation that most situations are just Telekinesis done in unique and creative ways." Yes, it sounds like it. And I agree we could probably safely say that as fact. Though it would ultimately be speculation on our part.

"I think Telekinesis as a standard should be any kinetic movement that can be used by distancely manipulating something, or kinetic energy. Biokinesis in my opinion is closer to manipulating the body in way not defined simply moving it or using kinetic energy to cause it harm." I agree. "Like how Crowley using Telekinetic power on people to cause hemorrhaging blood." Sounds like Biokinesis to me.

"Now like Molecular Combustion (MC) that could be either or Power or even simply a separate one." I say, separate power.

"I feel that Telekinesis, should be listed as all situations that you do if you were moving something with your hand or equipment." I agree.

"Like as examples grabbing an utensil or item or punching someone in the gut making them cough blood." If you mean using TK to enhance strength to hit them so hard they cough, then I agree.

"Biokinesis should be all like Angel healing power, pestilence or eve's powers. Something that changes the body outside that kinetic energy can do." I agree. "I feel Molecular Combustion should be a separate technique of Telekinesis. These are standards I wrote down fast." I feel that Molecular combustion is a completely separate power. Zane T 69 (talk) 19:54, December 20, 2016 (UTC)

Personally, I feel that, if you can manipulate life, you can also reverse it and damage it. Also, Biokinesis can also mean Biological Manipulation. Which supports using the ability positively, healing and such; or negatively causing cancer, mutating, coughing up blood.

Also, yes TK could eventually control blood, but likely only with experience. The experience of a user, say an angel should factor. IE An advanced practitioner could use TK to simulate Biokinesis. Where as a newer user couldn't. That's why I personally prefer to avoid this argument. It will take A LOT of time and be extremely confusing. That and you seem to be the only one who dislikes the current system.

If it helps, think of some users as using an Advanced for of TK to simulate Biokinesis. Possibly making Biokinesis both an independant skill AND a sub-skill of TK. Zane T 69 (talk) 21:19, December 20, 2016 (UTC)

I'm confused as well. I suggest you just bump the related blog and get multiple opinions. You should be able to do so, by merely editing it. Zane T 69 (talk) 22:00, December 20, 2016 (UTC)

Yes I know you wrote that blog, that's why I suggested you edit it. Lucifer is still just an Archangel, let's keep it simple. I can barely even understand your first paragraph.

"Also and this theory only not to be put into articles. I think I know how Amara can be both God's equal and superior. Amara is nothingness and darkness. While God is Light and Being. Well darkness simply exists it can change form... well easy its fluid in that way. Light can't change so much. So maybe God has to expel some power to be God. Otherwise he might not exist or just be a sacred light with a personality." Fanon/Speculation. Putting that in an article would hinder our credibility.

"Now this might be worthwhile information for trivia in God and Amara's relationship page. God compares himself and Amara like Yin/Yang. Well Yin is considered spiritual/feminine/darker while Yang is material/masculine/brighter. Seems like a noteworthy Easter egg right?" I agree. Zane T 69 (talk) 02:33, December 21, 2016 (UTC)

Okay, maybe the trivia section.

I was just clarifying my opinion.

I'll try editing blog, myself. It should be doable if you try updating it. I accidently did it on the versus blog. Zane T 69 (talk) 03:17, December 21, 2016 (UTC)

Didn't work. Zane T 69 (talk) 03:19, December 21, 2016 (UTC)

Delete this page[]

You only need to click this (it works this way to me). I'm not sure if using the buttom to link will work. Megstiel24 (talk) 02:32, November 9, 2016 (UTC)

PS: I tried to use the buttom "add link" but I got an error message saying the page doesn't exist. Don't know what that meant.

I take it, given that it was removed, that my observation on Archangels was not appreciated?

Den Éna Faskómilos (talk) 02:47, November 16, 2016 (UTC)

LuciferTheFallenAngel (talk) 07:15, November 21, 2016 (UTC)LuicferTheFallenAngelLuciferTheFallenAngel (talk) 07:15, November 21, 2016 (UTC)

I would like to know what I could help with. Please get me started, it would really be helpful.

Re: Rollback[]

Hi, TD5. How have you been doing? Hope you're well and good. I've noticed you were the one who unblocked Empyrean. While I have no issues about Empyrean being allowed to edit again, I do have some concerns about him being granted rollback powers. Would you be able to tell me how this was granted or was this a left-over from before he was banned? Or was it a different admin entirely who allowed it? Thank you. FTWinchester (talk) 14:04, December 8, 2016 (UTC)

Caleb gave me a detailed explanation. Thanks anyway. FTWinchester (talk) 23:32, January 14, 2017 (UTC)


Hey im new here and i wanna help people but im not sure how. If you have any ideas for me please write on my talk page

Enchantedstar (talk) 14:22, December 15, 2016 (UTC)

Reapers Etc.[]

Hey Twilight can you log into chat? We have to discuss something along with it. SeraphLucifer (talk) 19:50, February 5, 2017 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Hey, TD5. Seraph and I are gathering up the admins to discuss an infinite ban of ImperiexSeed via consensus. Please contact me with a good time or register your opinion on my talk page. Zane T 69 (talk) 15:36, February 16, 2017 (UTC)

The usual, false information, bias. I'm hoping once he see's this possible consequence he'll change for the better. Zane T 69 (talk) 19:35, February 16, 2017 (UTC)

Alright. Zane T 69 (talk) 22:19, February 16, 2017 (UTC)

Exactly, that's one of the reasons I want to infinite ban. Zane T 69 (talk) 22:31, February 16, 2017 (UTC)

Caleb informed me I needed to create a forum for an infinite ban of ImperiexSeed. If you would like too, please register your opinion here. Zane T 69 (talk) 16:00, February 17, 2017 (UTC)

Understandable. Zane T 69 (talk) 19:12, February 17, 2017 (UTC)

thank you so much for the greeting (re edit on Supernatural "Bad Day at Black Rock")! i forgot that i actually -do- have an account, just had never done anything with it...all signed in now, thank you!

how do i add that page edit to my profile info? i see there's a section there to add pages i've contributed to, and that would be kinda fun to say "look, i did a tiny thing!" LOL...

Frabbits (talk) 20:58, July 13, 2017 (UTC)

Season 13 Title Card for the main page ( just click the number ):



Hey Twilight, hope you are doing fine... Can we gather all active admins, I'd like to speak about something. SeraphLucifer (talk) 20:25, November 4, 2017 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

It's OK. We'll speak when you'd be avaiable. Also it'd be hard to gather all admins since you all have important work so I'll speak each one of you one by one. SeraphLucifer (talk) 17:49, November 5, 2017 (UTC)SeraphLucifer


can you tell me how delete a comment? I posted a comment under the wrong discussion and the site says that i'm not allowed to delete it Malthael Archangel of Death (talk) 18:17, November 17, 2017 (UTC)

Well, I can restore it, but it was an accidental posting on the wrong blog and they wanted it deleted. Zane T 69 (talk) 19:57, November 18, 2017 (UTC)

Thank you ! :) Sandrine Sand (talk) 19:45, November 30, 2017 (UTC)

The Empty[]

this is a transscript from the S13E04 

Sam and Dean, they must've made a deal.

No. No, no, no. Not with me, and I'm -- I'm the only one that has any pull here. Not Heaven, not Hell, not G-O-D himself. So think harder. Rack that perky little brain of yours.

He clearly states that he is the only one that has pull, i.e. power, in the empty. Amara would be included by default since she is not him. Him stating that "i'm the only one" is definitely exclusive to anyone else. It is an absolute statement, one that has not been countered as of yet. ThomasNealy (talk) 02:04, December 1, 2017 (UTC)

The issue with the logic of"she was not mentioned so she might be able to" is that it then opens the door to other beings and powers that are not of heaven, hell or God, to also being able to act with in the empty. If we do not take the Entity's statement as an absolute and allow for Amara simply because she was not used as an example, then we must also allow for every pagan god, resident of purgatory, witch, fairy, and every other manner of being and faction that has power. How ever if we take the list provided as a simple example in direct correlation with the statement "Sam and Dean made a deal" which would make sense as they are the three powers that Cas would be most familiar with when it comes to deals and or bringing people back, then the logic contridiction of the Entity's statment resolves it self.ThomasNealy (talk) 06:19, December 2, 2017 (UTC)

Forum talk[]

There is a discussion occurring on how we should format the Season pages and the episode summaries. Please join the discussion.Click here --ThomasNealy (talk) 05:04, December 14, 2017 (UTC)

New staff nominations.[]

Dtol has been nominated for Admin Vote for her HERE .
Zane T 69 has been nominated for Bureaucrat Vote for him HERE

Category Suggestion[]

Hey, i created a blog post about a new category, that i suggested to WarG and he agreed to ask to the others admins, see the post here. Doctor49 (talk) 00:26, January 9, 2018 (UTC)


The debate on what goes on the monster page has been reopened. Your opinion on the issue would be welcome. you can find the link here Talk:Monster#Monsters_omitted_part_2 Thank you--ThomasNealy (talk) 22:53, January 19, 2018 (UTC)

As one of the participants I thought you would like to know that Caleb has posted a Notice of Intent to close the discussion. He has also provided an idea on a compromise since he could see no clear resolution from the debate. Your opinion would be welcome on the matter. Thank You. --ThomasNealy (talk) 18:08, February 11, 2018 (UTC)

Page Suggestion[]

Hey, Im new here and was wondering if I could get pointers on creating a page, like Do's & Do Not's since I already made the error of posting a fanart. Anyway would appreciate your help coz I wanted to create a page where people can share their stories of how Supernatural helped them, like myself. Or does it already exist?

Kind Regards,

Castiela Winchester (talk) 15:50, January 28, 2018 (UTC)

Re: Page Suggestion[]

Thank you for your advice, wish me luck.

Castiela Winchester (talk) 09:23, January 29, 2018 (UTC)

New Policy Discussion[]

A new policy is being proposed you can find more information here and give your opinion here Standard vote options apply. Thank you. --ThomasNealy (talk) 20:46, February 3, 2018 (UTC)

The major change is the time and a set limit on enforcement. Most Of the police was taken from current policy that was scattered across different policies or guidelines the current image policy does not have a time requirement but rather states that the image may be deleted at any time. that can be found in the guild line "what he wiki is not". The problem came up when we tried to enforce it as we have been for months and one editor threw a fit. so rather then have vague and scattered policy on it now it will all be in one place and clearly written out. the key points are that the wiki does not act as a host for other sites and that all images uploaded to the wiki must be on the wiki and used with in 72 hours of upload or they will be deleted. exceptions can be made as needed just by contacting an admin or mod. if you have any suggestions on what I wrote out on the section below the talk feel free to make them. --ThomasNealy (talk) 00:45, February 21, 2018 (UTC)


I am new to all this and would love to join in on the Supernatural CommuintyLissWinchester (talk) 01:25, April 28, 2018 (UTC)

What's poppin' my dude?

EatThatPussy2018 (talk) 04:50, May 13, 2018 (UTC)

Mark of Cain[]

You made a writing mistake, you wrote welder and not wielder while you added a fact.

--Mgdodl (talk) 17:45, May 29, 2018 (UTC)

I fixed it for you. Zane T 69 (talk) 19:26, May 29, 2018 (UTC)
That bit of trivia makes no sense. The Mark only works in that way if someone actually has it, meaning that Cain would have to be the one to transfer it himself. The Bible says God will punish whoever harms Cain sevenfold. Two completely different scenarios.
Orion (T-B-C) 19:29, May 29, 2018 (UTC)
And that's why it's speculation and should be removed. I'd do it myself, but the article is locked.
Orion (T-B-C) 22:11, May 29, 2018 (UTC)

Did you mean to send that message to Orion? All I did was fix a typo that was mentioned above. Zane T 69 (talk) 00:45, May 30, 2018 (UTC)

Then I agree that it's speculative and needs to be removed. Zane T 69 (talk) 02:31, May 30, 2018 (UTC)

The trivia section is not a loophole. I have removed speculation from ALL sections with impunity and admin approval for years.

Orion (T-B-C) 06:15, May 30, 2018 (UTC)

Than explain pages like The Darkness, The Leviathans, and Jack to name of few. They have reference to events or fictional versions of characters, or other series.

  • The Darkness has references to its sealing and nature as a being on its page for a few years now.

Some religions have similar structure to what the Darkness is.

  • The terrible battle between God and the Darkness bares some similarities with the first day of creation in Genesis (God separated the darkness from the light).
  • Chaos/Nun in Greek/Egyptian mythology, which predated everything and created or from which the deities came from.[17]
  • Erebus and Nyx/Nox in Greco-Roman Mythology, Erebus being the male primordial embodiment of darkness, and Nyx/Nox being the female primordial embodiment of night/darkness.
  • Amatsu-Mikaboshi in Japanese Shinto Mythology, was originally a Shinto god of the Pole Star and the primordial chaos.
  • Ginnungagap from the Norse Creation Myth, was a primordial void.[18]
  • The Darkness by far is most similar to Angra Mainyu, the brother of Ahura Mazda from Zoroastrianism. He is considered the opposite of Ahura Mazda and represents elemental darkness and evil.

The Leviathans are reference to Lovecraft. They were referred to as "The Old Ones" by Death.

  • This (may) be a reference to the ancient creatures described by H.P. Lovecraft, who had previously created a portal to Purgatory, where the Leviathan were once imprisoned.

Jack has this reference to another series, not made by the show.

  • He bears similarities to The Source's Heir from Charmed. Both are the unborn child of the show's version of or equivalent to the Devil, both are able to channel their powers from the womb and both play a role in the deaths of a powerful, apparently unstoppable demon, Dagon in the case of and The Tall Man in the case of the Source's Heir. Both demons were also killed by a powerful fire ability that incinerated them.

See not so black and white. While speculation in pages isn’t allowed, non-confirmed or theories are allowed in trivia sections, as listed in my three examples. As long as they are reasonably possible or noteworthy.[[User:Twilight Despair 5|]] ([[The God of Creation]]) (talk) 06:31, May 30, 2018 (UTC)

I protested against those and was met with resistance from regular editors. I never bothered to go back and delete it, but it should be.

Orion (T-B-C) 13:40, June 1, 2018 (UTC)

Image removal request[]

I'm director PJ Pesce--you have a picture of Joe Carnahan up for me!

Can you please fix it?

21:39, June 27, 2018 (UTC)~

Yeah, I looked for it too, but we'll just have to hope he can link us to it. Zane T 69 (talk) 13:38, June 28, 2018 (UTC)

Hopefully it was. P.J Pesce is writer and director and would surely type better than that. Still, we can't do anything without a link and are stuck until we get one, but I'm inclined to believe it was was fake. A writer using such poor English? Seems questionable and I don't think we should worry about it until we get a link to the affected page or actual picture. Zane T 69 (talk) 17:47, June 28, 2018 (UTC)

Welcome Message[]

I've looked into the welcome message, and the Welcome Tool for Fandom states that the welcome message is given by whomever was the last admin to edit, although this doesn't appear to be the case here. The list of these messages are here: [2], and from what I've checked, all use your account. The welcome user page at [3] looks like it uses the latest admin to edit. This could be changed to a single user or the issue brought up with fandom staff. I don't want to change anything without consulting the other admins, so I'll leave a message on their talk pages and decide what the best course of action is. Hope the issue gets resolved soon. Dtol (talk) 09:40, July 15, 2018 (UTC)

You are free to protect your own, but I need mine to run the wikis defense. Zane T 69 (talk) 21:19, February 7, 2019 (UTC)

I'm aware, but I still need to run the wikis defense and that requires talking with other users. I've already removed Unregistered and new users editing rights. I hated doing it, but I needed to as part of a strategy to reduce vandal attacks. Zane T 69 (talk) 21:29, February 7, 2019 (UTC)

I understand that. If I didn’t have a full time career job I would leave mine open. But as not on for long periods most days, I decided to lock mine. After a few days I’ll unprotect mine for messages.[[User:Twilight Despair 5|]] ([[The God of Creation]]) (talk) 21:32, February 7, 2019 (UTC)

IP block[]

Hey TD5, I recognize the IP address belonged to the persistent vandal, but keep in mind that IP addresses change and therefore we do not give indefinite blocks for IP addresses (because it might prevent a future legitimate user from editing), and we generally refrain from giving too long a block, and in this case especially, there is not much point as the vandal is using a VPN to change IP addresses. I have reverted the block to its original length. Cheers. Calebchiam Talk 15:01, February 10, 2019 (UTC)

I'm not sure I understand what you're getting at. Are you familiar with how a VPN works? Calebchiam Talk 15:16, February 10, 2019 (UTC)
I'm familiar with how they work - having used them and having studied computer networks. You can understand it like this - by tapping onto a VPN, you have access to other computer nodes across the world and this set of nodes is constantly in flux (as other people using the VPN often themselves serve as nodes for other users.) Consequently, the IPs you can change to are random but associated with a region that you can specify. So yes, obviously we block the IP that the user is currently editing from. But with a VPN it is trivial to change to another node and edit from that node's IP. It is unlikely however that they will switch back to the previously-blocked node because of the aforementioned randomness. Calebchiam Talk 15:25, February 10, 2019 (UTC)

It's fine. I know that you're busy and have a busy life. I appreciate you checking on the wiki despite that though. Zane T 69 (talk) 20:30, February 10, 2019 (UTC)

Your password should be fine, but if you want to make sure and create a better one then go ahead. It's up to you and they were confirmed as safe by a VSTF and Community Central Admin. Zane T 69 (talk) 05:00, February 11, 2019 (UTC)


Hello its been a while. I created a template for the administration you are welcome to add it to your Profile. It’s called Administrator. Dominic1743 (talk) 00:59, February 13, 2019 (UTC)

Primordial Entities page[]

Hey was just wondering if you still wanted to change the page to Cosmic Beings. With proper consensus of course. Dominic1743 (talk) 21:07, March 17, 2019 (UTC)


Wiki Manager Introduction[]

Hi there!

I'm SilverFlight, here to serve as Supernatural Wiki's liason - the go-to user for when you need assistance from full-time staff and eager to answer if you ever have a question or issue(s) relating to the wiki, users, etc.

In addition, I'm happy to inform you that Fandom is upgrading its MediaWiki platform to accommodate MediaWiki extensions. You can read more about here on the blog post.

If you have any other questions, please contact me on my talk page. Let me know how I can help.

The Silver wings of Night (talk) 02:40, June 21, 2019 (UTC)

Fandom Discord[]

Hello Twilight Despair 5!
I'm excited to let you know that Fandom now has an official Discord server for all Fandom and Gsmepedia editors. If you want to learn more about it, details can be found here on community blog. Let me know if you have any questions!

The Silver wings of Night (talk) 23:02, July 9, 2019 (UTC)

Analytics Update[]

Hi Twilight Despair 5! I wanted to inform you that there is a new Special:Analytics page you can request and access on the admin dashboard! In this way, you can use it to keep track of the number of edits daily, and which users are contributing. More info is available on the Help:Analytics dashboard and the blog post. If you have any questions, let me know!

The Silver wings of Night (talk) 02:23, August 10, 2019 (UTC)

Editor Rewards[]

Hi again! I'm happy to tell you that there's a new Editor Rewards program honoring the hard work of users with awards those that have gained recognition for their contributions. Details are on this blog post. If you could give some feedback at this blog post, it would be greatly appreciated. Please message me if you have any questions!

The Silver wings of Night (talk) 01:21, September 2, 2019 (UTC)

Editor Experience[]

Hey Twilight! Just letting you know the Supernatural Wiki has been selected for a test run with the new "Editor Experience" tool. It's a how-to-feature that walks users through editing the page via an interactive "tour". Please let me know on any feedback you have on the tool; all feedback is welcome!

The Silver wings of Night (talk) 15:57, September 17, 2019 (UTC)

Hello. There is currently an important discussion about the wikis future in regards to the soon to be replaced Forums by Fandom. Please get involved here. Zane T 69 (talk) 17:47, November 2, 2019 (UTC)

Well thank you for making time for the matter. I hope work isn't too crazy for you. Zane T 69 (talk) 19:29, November 2, 2019 (UTC)

Global Taxonomy[]

Hi there! I'm happy to introduce to you the new feature called the Global Taxonomy. This formula accumulates wikis a user visits and generates a list of recommended wikis for them to visit. In other words, people who have an interest in a topic or genre you entail will be recommended a chance to visit this wiki! That will be perfect for garnering visitors here. You can read more about it on the blog, plus if you're interested in template use, you can check out this link, too. Hope you find them helpful!

The Silver wings of Night (talk)
22:12, December 1, 2019 (UTC)

Desynoping Inactive Admins[]

Sorry to bother you, but can I get your opinion on Forum:Desynoping Inactive admins? Thanks. Dominic1743 (talk) 10:51, December 15, 2019 (UTC)

Featured Video[]

Hi there! Writing to tell you about changes coming to FANDOM featured videos: as of the end of this December, they will be receiving some trial run experiments. This is being done to improve video quality since videos featured on a page tend to be outdated or spout all the information the user can already read on the article. The main goal will be to figure out how to complement wiki content. Because of that, you might receive a video called "The Loop" play for anonymous users, which will be meant purely to collect visitation data in the vein of the Global Taxonomy method. It won't affect all users, so you might not notice. But if you want to learn more, you can go to the blog post. Let me know if you have any questions!

The Silver wings of Night (talk)
23:07, December 16, 2019 (UTC)

Citation Change[]

Hi! Hope you're doing well. I need your opinion on this please.

Thanks! FTWinchester (talk) 23:21, December 22, 2019 (UTC)

Castiel's Page[]

Don't you think that we should separate Castiel's powers with his other abilities, such as his fighting and hunting skills?

User talk:AnitaSalim, December 24 2019.


Hey, there's a discussion for admin rights going on, here.--Mgdodl (talk) 19:13, January 18, 2020 (UTC)

New Forum for a serious issue (IMO)[]

This is about the bloated articles and sections I've noticed a lot recently. Please give your thoughts on the subject here.

Orion (T-B-C) 13:12, February 2, 2020 (UTC)


I just wanted to inform you that I won't be as active as much due to personal issues. Hopefully my activity will be back to normal before or after the new episode airs. I will try to edit at least once a week.

Thanks! Admin // Dominic1743 (T-C-L) 17:03, February 9, 2020 (UTC)


Everything is back to normal now. Admin // Dominic1743 (T-C-L) 05:08, February 25, 2020 (UTC)

Re: Pad of Definitions[]

Is the official website for the Pad even accessible still? I would most definitely agree with you on a case-to-case basis but as far as I know, the original source has been shut down. Contents have been archived by other websites, yes. But there is no guarantee on whether it has been copied 100% accurately. And even if we go by individual case review, if majority of the material proves to have been retconned out or is no longer relevant, it weakens the overall source. Might I also redirect your response to the citation discussion so that we can all contribute instead of messaging each other's talk pages. It's a bit hard to track. FTWinchester (talk) 15:09, February 25, 2020 (UTC)

Your new Wiki Manager[]

Hey there! I'm Cörey, the new Wiki Manager for the Supernatural wiki.

I'll be taking over for SilverFlight. Just like Julia, I'm here to help out however I can. Just let me know! You can usually find me on Discord (my username is penguinstyles#9735), however, I'm happy to use whatever contact medium you prefer.

If you have any questions for me, please let me know. I'll try to respond to them as quickly as I can.

-- Cörey (talk) 05:53, March 2, 2020 (UTC)


Wanted to let you know we now have a discord and you are welcome to sign up preferably with your existing username.

Thanks! Admin // Dominic1743 (T-C-L) 05:33, March 3, 2020 (UTC)

Unbiased Review[]

You may have recently received a notification about a message on Dominic1743's "Personal wiki" and that is what this is in regards too. I blocked Dominic, pending review, for three months for vote stacking and stealth canvassing and I'm trying to find trustworthy, experienced, and bi-partial users to review his actions and the block implemented. I will disclose that Dominic recently accepted nomination of an RfB (Request for Bureaucrat rights) and apart from a factual correction about my activity; I viewed it as misinformation to create a need for another bureaucrat roll for Dominic to fill, it seemed entirely above-board and seemed run honestly. If you receive this message then I want your opinion on if the block was justified and if his offenses were accurately described.

For the "offenses" please refer here. Zane T 69 (talk) 21:55, March 6, 2020 (UTC)


Hey, I didn't send you a message on Discord any time. If you received a message from someone claiming to be me recently, that's an impersonator. Calebchiam Talk 09:31, May 5, 2020 (UTC)


Would that require consensus or not sense its been called that in the show?Dominic1743 (talk) 01:52, 18 October 2020 (UTC)

I checked the page, and I have seen that you mentioned it twice, and if no one objects after two weeks, it may implement. You can start another topic Here, or add on a current one. Dominic1743 (talk) 02:38, 18 October 2020 (UTC)


Yes!Dominic1743 (talk)

Latest message to me[]

Uh... what??? I have no idea what you're talking about or why you sent that to me.--WarGrowlmon18 (talk) 01:11, 19 November 2020 (UTC)

The whole using telekinesis to crush organs and stuff thing??? I agree on that one myself actually, that was how I originally thought of it until I saw people listing it as a separate power. I was never convinced on that, especially when the hand movements suggest that they are just applying pressure to crush an organ or something. I do think Molecular Combustion is a separate power though since they are literally getting blown apart on a subatomic level. Telekinesis certainly can't do that. Whoever set up the Biokinesis thing being separate from telekinesis is long before my time though, I didn't have a hand in that one.--WarGrowlmon18 (talk) 02:08, 19 November 2020 (UTC)

I always thought of Astral Projection more like what they did in season 4 with Pamela than what's been listed on here. Not sure where angels showing their wings as Astral Projection came from. Again, before my time and I just went with it. I think the other ones more sensing stuff isn't it??? That's not one I'm really familiar with. As for MC, that's not just God power that's also Archangel power. Mostly Luci and Raphy power but still. Also Jack power. Cas specifically said he was torn apart on the subatomic level, I think when he explained Jimmy's death to Claire.--WarGrowlmon18 (talk) 04:54, 19 November 2020 (UTC)

Well the AP and other one I don't really know enough about to have an opinion on but MC is entirely separate from telekinesis. I know so much about it and like it so much because it was my favorite power on Charmed growing up. The old one not the reboot, I've never bothered to waste my time with that one. The early uses of it on this show were messy to say the least but the later uses, particularly in Season 13, are much closer to the Charmed version. And might I point out that that's not just a God/Archangel power??? Dagon and Asmodeus both used it too.--WarGrowlmon18 (talk) 05:09, 19 November 2020 (UTC)

No, I'm not on the MC. Its a major stretch to make it an advancement of telekinesis.--WarGrowlmon18 (talk) 01:50, 20 November 2020 (UTC)