Supernatural Wiki
Supernatural Wiki
Deanlaptop.jpg Leave your name, number and nightmare at the tone.
Personal queries, requests, hunting gigs, and whatnot go here. Please create a new section as needed according to topic to facilitate communication. Cheers!


Nightmares start here[]

Hi, welcome to Supernatural Wiki! Thanks for your edit to the User blog:RiderJones/Aliens in Supernatural page.

Please leave a message on my talk page if I can help with anything! -- Thesilentpoethosea (Talk) 16:00, October 14, 2012

Can you meet me on chat? -- ImperiexSeed, 6:06 PM, October 23rd 2012

Re: Hey![]

Yes, I'm back. :D For a while now, I hope, since I'm officially out of school.

I'll check your proposal on the tense/grammar guide out ASAP!

-Sybil (Blessed Be, Sybil 05:03, June 21, 2013 (UTC))

Back me up[]

Hello FTWinchester. I need some backing up. Maybe you've noticed, maybe you haven't, but there has a debate going on between me and different users about the word "master" on Metatron's page. I say that it needs to be "Master", since it is in reference to God. However other users are adamant that it be "master", which incorrect. I made section in the talk page for Metatron, which is where I need your backing. I appreciate your help.

SilverRain (talk) 01:29, November 30, 2012 (UTC)

I agree that the proper nouns you speak of, like "He", "Him", or "Master", can be capitalized even in-between a sentence, as it's referencing God. But I wouldn't say it's strictly grammatically incorrect if you don't, I mean, I myself mostly just use lowercase lettering even when talking about God, although I do capitalize "God", "Lord", "Jesus". -- ImperiexSeed, 8:38 PM, November 29th 2012
On a personal note, I prefer using capitalized pronouns and such, because 1) I am a Catholic, and 2) the show features the Judeo-Christian God as the Supreme Being, anyway. However, as we are a community with different beliefs, I would not want to impose such things on others. I raised this concern a few weeks ago, but I garnered no response at all. Why don't we just put the matter to vote. Majority wins. FTWinchester (talk) 05:19, November 30, 2012 (UTC)
Unfortunately, that is not how community decisions are made on wikis, FTWinchester. According to Calebchiam, there must be a general consensus among users, regardless of a majority vote. 06:21, November 30, 2012 (UTC)
Forgive me, but could you define what makes a 'general consensus' different from a majority vote? As far as I know, a consensus is reached by a mutual agreement among the population--although a majority vote is not necessary, it more or less shows the prevailing opinion on all the members of the wiki. Of course some discussion has to follow, but when you have most of the wiki agreeing on one thing, isn't that basically a consensus? FTWinchester (talk) 13:47, November 30, 2012 (UTC)
No, general consesus means everyone involved in the discussion must be in full agreement. According to Calebchiam, wikis do not operate on majority votes and when there is a lack of consesnus in a discussion than the status quo is kept. You can read what he said about making community decisions with general consensus over a majority vote on the Talk:Wincest page in the Deletion? discussion. 20:30, November 30, 2012 (UTC)
Consensus could differ from a majority vote, I guess. Realistically, the wiki completely isn't going to agree on something no matter the topic - there's always going to unreasonably disagreeable users, so to me, a majority vote makes more sense and is achievable. -- ImperiexSeed, 7:27 PM, November 30th 2012
That may be so, ImperiexSeed, but as I said wikis do not operate by such methods of community decision-making and we must abide by that policy as is our obligation as users . We both know Calebchiam well enough that strives to uphold the Wikia policies, so it's unlikely he will overlook users settling a debate not by the book as he will undoubtfully view the Metatron and his Master discussion as a lack of consensus and decree that the page remain as is in order to keeper the status quo, regardless how many users are opposed. 00:48, December 1, 2012 (UTC)
I kindly disagree. Ah, well this policy regulation is like the following analogy. It could resemble asking a group of people of varying religions to agree on a God -- philosophically, it's an expectation doomed to fail. There's no way 100% of the contributors here are going to agree on something. My perception remains the same, it'd make more sense if it were a majority vote. I'm in no way obstructing or defiling this wiki's policies, I'm just giving an alternative that makes more more sense. -- ImperiexSeed, 7:57 PM, November 30th 2012
ImperiexSeed, I understand what you are saying and do I agree that a majority vote is more practical, but we can not go with such an alternative simply because we disagree with a general Wikia policy. As an admin, you do not even have the authority to call for a vote to settle a debate. Please do not say you do as I learned that from Caleb himself who is far more versed in Wikia's policies than either us. 01:25, December 1, 2012 (UTC)

Well, some consensus operate on having a super majority vote (65%, 80%, etc.), but anyway. In a consensus, while not all may agree, those with disagreement may give consent to the majority if it is overwhelming. But I digress. As of now we are locked in this issue, with only maybe 5 users actively participating. That is hardly a consensus, meaning status quo should remain. But what is our status quo? FTWinchester (talk) 03:58, December 1, 2012 (UTC)
Well, I looked into the Metatron page's edit history and 'master" in sentence was initially with a lowercase lettering when a unregistered user had changed it to such from "father", than SilverRain himself capitalized it afterwards. So I would assume the word uncapitalized would be the status quo as that is how it was originally typed on the page. In addition, regarding how the consensus operates on wikis, from what I can gather is it must be overall agreement as Calebchiam stated even if there were 4 users who believed a page should be deleted and 3 who disagreed, than the page would not be deleted as there is no consensus. Although I believe you may be correct in regards to those who disagree giving consent to the majority (or even minority). 04:27, December 1, 2012 (UTC)

Yo! I'd like to talk to you on chat. It'll take only a minute. -- ImperiexSeed, 7:30 PM, December 1st 2012

Regarding the policy on consensus, to clarify, it is not a majority vote, meaning that we do not move forward with a certain action because 60% of users agree, and 40% disagree. That being said, it does not mean that 100% of users have to agree either. The idea of consensus is that we seek to address as many concerns as possible. If valid and undeniable points are brought up by the 40%, we do not ignore them, but seek compromises so that we can move forward. The policy on consensus can be found here.

As stated on that page:

"Consensus is not what everyone agrees to, nor is it the preference of the majority. Consensus results in the best solution that the group can achieve at the time. Remember, the root of "consensus" is "consent". This means that even if parties disagree, there is still overall consent to move forward in order to settle the issue."

So, when we say 'general consensus', we are talking about this overall consent. Overall consent is not reached if there are significant points brought up by either group that aren't addressed sufficiently. In addition, it does not require the participation of all users in the Wiki, merely those involved in the discussion, however, this should still be a substantial group of participants. Larger policy changes require a greater amount of participation in the discussion from the community. Hope this clears things up, cheers. Calebchiam Talk 08:39, December 2, 2012 (UTC)

Awesome. Cheers. FTWinchester (talk) 13:34, December 2, 2012 (UTC)

I would've, yes. But, the photo linings seem to have been deleted. Go to the links, and you'll see. So, how are you liking Season 8 so far.... Definitely not as good as Season 5, but sill one of the best. -- ImperiexSeed, 12:58 PM, February 7th 2013

Re:Narrative articles[]

Hey, sorry for the late reply, I was busy for the past few dates. Anyway, regarding your question, both systems do work, but they have their pros and cons. A season-based narrative might make more sense to readers since events are revealed according to the sequence of the episode releases. For example, a chronological narrative would have mentioned the YED feeding Sam demon blood early on in the article (which would make little sense to the uninitiated) while the season-based narrative would set the stage for this important reveal. The season-based narrative is also easier to create, maintain and organise since the information has a clear sorting. That being said, a chronological narrative is much more professional, and allows the segments of the narrative to be sorted into major arcs/storylines rather than episode numbers. It's largely the preference of the Wiki that decides which system to use, although I do lean towards the latter. If you're willing to embark on the task of making the articles on this Wiki consistent with the latter format, be my guest. :) Calebchiam Talk 13:43, February 15, 2013 (UTC)

Hi. FTWinchester, I'm only going to say this once, so listen up. You, at every turn, pounce on every presentable chance to prove me wrong, and I'm getting sick of it. So, stop! You're a self-proclaimed knowitall, nothing more. I like being you friend, but when you're trying to prove me wrong, I get irresistibly irritable. -- ImperiexSeed, 4:09 PM, February 28th 2013

Did you read my message fully--well, did you? It would seem that you didn't, seeing as you accused me of at least two things I didn't do.

1) I never told you to stop editing, in my post- I said, "stop" antagonistically pinning and attacking my posts. Whatever - have a different opinion - I don't care. But it's when you say the exact opposite of what I'm saying that gets me. 2) I needn't look it (the meaning of the phrase, "Self-proclaimed Know-it-all") up - I know very well what it means. It means, you THINK, from your lens, that you you're a better and smarter editor than everybody else.

You're a fine editor, and have much potential here, editing the Supernatural wiki. Keep up the good work. :)

-- ImperiexSeed, 9:27 PM, March 1st 2013

Hi. I thought we got passed this, but, on the blog, you started your instigation again. The term 'Archangel' was first used first used in "Houses of Holy", yes, and an Archangel physically appeared in "Tall Tales", but, in "Free To Be You And Me", is the first time it's called an Archangel and appeared. -- ImperiexSeed, 1:24 PM, March 22nd 2013

Ok? You're right, in "Tall Tales", an Archangel appeared 'physically', in a vessel. And, yes, Archangels are first mentioned in "Houses of Holy." But, "Free To Be You And Me" is the first episode where an Archangel physically appears and is confirmed. -- ImperiexSeed, 10:14 PM, March 22nd 2013

Yes, you're welcome. Your templates - man, did they come out splendidly! The utilization of those on the compatible pages enthralls me . -- ImperiexSeed, 12:25 PM, March 23rd 2013

Hey, would you, at a time that's convenient, mind doing a total revamp on the Seraph page? It needs a ton of work done, regarding grammar, punctuation, word usage, etc. Because, honestly, it looks awful right now. Thanks. -- ImperiexSeed, 3:15 PM, March 30th 2013

re:template proposal[]

Hey FTWinchester. Haha yeah, these templates are pretty sick, nice work. I think you can go ahead and edit the templates as necessary.

On a side note though, we have to be careful about where we use the second template. Just with reference to the examples you mentioned, since the content you mentioned is probably explicitly stated as conjecture/speculation or inductive logic in general, use of that template would not be applicable since it's meant for canonical information that has been seemingly contradicted in later episodes.

Perhaps another idea for a template might be to have one stating that the following article/section of the article contains conjecture or speculation? Just a thought.

Cheers! :) Calebchiam Talk 15:31, March 22, 2013 (UTC)

Hi, FTWinchester, I just wanted to let you know I am definitely liking the templates you have created so far. If I may, I suggest updating the spoiler template as it's format differs from the one your using. Keep up the good work! 04:14, March 23, 2013 (UTC)

Thank you for your support, Wiki Contributor. I'll try to take a look into your suggestion, and if Calebchiam and the community will allow me to do so. FTWinchester (talk) 05:30, March 23, 2013 (UTC)

I think this is where you reply to your template proposal, I would to say they all look great, and I really think you should create them, and I hope you are able to. I just have two disagreements: the first is your "Retcon/Conflict in Canon" template, I don't think thats ones necessary, as as far as I know there has been no true example of reconing, for examples, firstly at no point did anyone say there was only four archangels, that was simply the number that appeared in season five. Secondly its entirely possible he could have a step-father who, considering his orginal one abbandoned him, he took as his real father. My point is there has been no complete recon's yet, so including it would mearly cause disputes over wether it was a recon or not.

Second is your bias template, I can see that being abused, as I personally have been involved in a number of whats bias whats fact debates, with other users, many of which only got resolved because one side gave up, so I would recomend agaist creating that template, as I can only see it being abused. Those are my only two disagreements, and that is simply my advice. Appart from that I'm behind you 100%. General MGD 109 (talk) 21:55, March 23, 2013 (UTC)

Yeah, General's right - in the show, it's never said that there's only 4 Archangels, it's just the number of them that appeared. ImperiexSeed, 6:02 PM, March 23rd 2013
General, what about the offscreen retcon of Chuck being God? Shortly after "Swan Song" there were confirmations from both Rob Benedict and Eric Kripke that it was true, but than after Sera Gamble became showrunner, it had reportedly been stated as otherwise. So I would say there is indeed a pontential use for the "Retcon/Conflict in Canon" template. 01:41, March 24, 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for all your input, guys and/or gals. Correct me if I'm wrong, but so far, the only problematic templates we have are for the 'Retcon/Conflict in Canon' and 'Bias', but everyone who has provided feedback so far agree to the creation of the rest? May I ask your opinion on which template for 'Disambiguation' do you prefer? The Misha or the Balthazar template? I will try to wait for maybe another day before I start creating the other templates, just to give a bit more time for other contributors to weigh in on the subject. FTWinchester (talk) 02:24, March 24, 2013 (UTC)

Hey FTWinchester. Yep, glad you could get it to work. It's pretty much just creating the template page with an appropriate name, posting the html code, and then using {{Template name}} on pages as necessary. There's also the issue of template documentation, which details whether there are parameters that need to be filled and how the template should be used but we can always work on it later on since it's quite secondary. And yes, you understood correctly what I said about the second template.

As for which template to use...I personally find the 'Misha' one more humourous, although technically, disambiguation pages are for different subjects with the same name, and the Misha example in the show is really the same subject but with a different name (or different subjects with different names, depending on how you want to argue it). So it might be less appropriate, but this is nitpicking somewhat. The Balthazar one is still good though. Cheers. Calebchiam Talk 10:08, March 24, 2013 (UTC)

Articles are supposed to be completely neutral, so to have a template for bias would imply that we actually condone it in articles. The retcon template is alright in theory, whether or not there are any examples of retconning in the series is another thing, but it certainly doesn't hurt to have the template. Calebchiam Talk 12:08, March 24, 2013 (UTC)

I have watched buffy and watched some of Angel. Personally, I think Buffy is an average show. I dont like it as much as supernatural, vampire diaries, being human UK, or true blood. I think Buffy was very butt kicking show, but I didnt like the storylines, didnt like most of the characters, I didnt like them introducing all these demons and not sticking to vampires and introducing greater vampire threats. The only characters I happened to like on buffy were Spike, Faith, Turok Han Vampire and Caleb. Adam was cool too, with his gun hand. Im sticking to the winchesters for slaying

ThomasAtticusSilas2013+ (talk) 20:29, March 24, 2013 (UTC)

I'd prefer this Wiki use the Misha one for our disambiguation, because, well, the appearance of Misha - it invokes Castiel. -- ImperiexSeed, 3:12 PM, March 30th 2013

Sorry about deleting a section in th Hunter page. I was trying to add some hunters that were missing, and accidentlly deleted a portion. Sorry for the mess!

No, problem man! I actually had the same issue when I first began adding gifs myself. For the gif to work you need to add |frame| instead of |thumb|, for example instead of File:Angelsfalling.gif|thumb|right| it would be File:Angelsfalling.gif|frame|right|. Bkshadows (talk) 03:07, May 20, 2013 (UTC)Bkshadows

I just saw your edit on Prometheus's page about Chronos...As far as I know, the Chronos shown on the show was the god who could control time and not the Titan Kronos/Cronus..Generally people confuse them due to similar sounding names, but they are said to be different...ME$$AIAH 05:21, May 20, 2013 (UTC)RaghavD

I personally think your exagerating, but I do see your point about the same thing be repeated. However as the information is generally presented in different ways, I don't really see the need to remove it. General MGD 109 (talk) 19:43, May 25, 2013 (UTC)

Okay, maybe your not exagerating, but I carefully read the page over, from top to bottom and I can say that it seems okay now. All in I think its okay leaving it now. General MGD 109 (talk) 17:51, May 26, 2013 (UTC)

Using Past Tense[]

While it's true that using past tense in canon is better to read, but have you truly seen the number of pages that have to be modified, buddy? I did edit the Harvelle's Roadhouse and Ash pages into past tense, but we need to start right from Season 1's Pilot episode. Do we start editing or we leave the pages like that and make sure that newly created pages are written in past tense?RaghavD The One and Only 16:46, June 4, 2013 (UTC)

Sorry to, say, butt in, but yes, I do think we need to weld them into PAST TENSE if needed. -- ImperiexSeed, 12:48 PM, June 4th 2013
Well then we better start right away, afterall there is no use waiting, while doing something good(It's a saying in my native tongue) :PRaghavD The One and Only 16:54, June 4, 2013 (UTC)
Time's a-wasting, currently. Get a move on it! ha ha -- ImperiexSeed, 12:57 PM, June 4th 2013
I edited the Wendigo episode. I'm not 100% happy as some sentences didn't quite sit together. But it'll do for the moment.RaghavD The One and Only 17:09, June 4, 2013 (UTC)
I have been advocating this for months now and nobody is listening to me, which is why I put emphasis. Nobody even responded to this forum that it's bsolutely frustrating. It's not like the community won't benefit, I just don't know why people won't show support. FTWinchester (talk) 17:34, June 4, 2013 (UTC)
And I am well aware of the number of articles that need to be rewritten, but I can't do it all. Everybody needs to follow guidelines. Unfortunately, the guidelines I proposed haven't garnered any solid support to turn them into actual policies. FTWinchester (talk) 17:37, June 4, 2013 (UTC)
In this, I support you fully, bro! Just, tell me how I can help. -- ImperiexSeed, 1:38 PM, June 4th 2013
Thanks. If you agree to the proposal, two things need to be done--the first being disseminating information about the proper tense usage, and the second being adhering to the guidelines. Again, thank you very much. FTWinchester (talk) 17:41, June 4, 2013 (UTC)
Hmm, maybe we could assemble a team of selective users who go around fixing the tense usage in adherence to its guidelines? -- ImperiexSeed, 1:48 PM, June 4th 2013
That would actually be great, but seeing as I had very little to no success in the matter, I suppose an admin like you would have more success. FTWinchester (talk) 01:53, June 5, 2013 (UTC)
Don't be ridiculous. Let's make it happen! Enlist users like General MGD 109, Twilight Despair 5, and MisterRandom. Hang a message on all of their talk pages, stating what needs to be done. I PAST TENSED some info on the soul page. -- ImperiexSeed, 12:17 PM, June 5th 2013
Alright, thanks, man. FTWinchester (talk) 02:21, June 6, 2013 (UTC)
Yep, yep. Let's do this thang. ha ha -- ImperiexSeed, 12:12 PM, June 6th 2013
Sure I'll joint you, I agree the pages should be in past tense. Thanks for inviting me. General MGD 109 (talk) 21:21, June 6, 2013 (UTC)
Just let me know what and where you want me to do. General MGD 109 (talk) 21:33, June 6, 2013 (UTC)
What about me? Self-Declared God of Supreme Conduits (talk) 21:43, June 6, 2013 (UTC) Kesslerbeast
Sure, man. It wasn't my intention to leave you out, I was just quite preoccupied in the Buffy wikia, so I wasn't able to ask everyone currently active in joining. Thanks for your support! FTWinchester (talk) 21:51, June 6, 2013 (UTC)

re: Rising Son talk[]

It's cool, man. It just boiled down to fanwank, anyway.-- 19:35, June 8, 2013 (UTC)

re: Lust+Chastity[]

It's fine, dude. We all usually miss something when we're adding something. And I really enjoy the irony of the same actress playing Lust and "Chastity"--didn't even realize that until you posted it.-- 15:35, June 9, 2013 (UTC)

Give me five minutes. General MGD 109 (talk) 20:46, June 9, 2013 (UTC)

Done, I hope its up to standard. General MGD 109 (talk) 21:05, June 9, 2013 (UTC)


If you have time, care to get on the chat?[[User:Twilight Despair 5|]] ([[The God of Creation]]) (talk) 16:55, June 11, 2013 (UTC)


Well, this is up for discussion. But frankly, from experience, affiliations don't do very much for raising our page views & site visits, rather, SEO (search-engine optimisation) and appearing 1st in Google search results is what gets people visiting our site. So I don't really see much point in affiliation, unless it's for another Supernatural Wiki (e.g. Supernatural Fan Fiction), because then in a sense, we are from the same community of editors. Whereas in the case of BTVS and Charmed, there is virtually no link between the two apart from the fact that the shows are of the supernatural genre.

So yeah, it doesn't do much for us nor is it a particularly meaningful affiliation. Good point about the links to other CW wikis though, those aren't official affiliates, it's just Wikia arbitrarily sneaking in links to other Wikis so as to prove Wikia's overall search ranking (because people spending more time on Wikis is a plus for them). I would go ahead and remove them, but something tells me you'll want to push for affiliation with Buffyverse anyway? Calebchiam Talk 04:18, June 18, 2013 (UTC)

Yep, of course, it's always open for discussion. But it's one thing to visit another Wiki to learn from them, it's another to start becoming an active editor there. Perhaps more would visit (though personally, I never click on affiliate links) but I think you'll agree that it's unlikely editors of another Wiki would suddenly decide to become active editors on this Wiki unless they were already interested in the show. (And if they already were, they would have found this Wiki already.)
Just to clarify though, there is no precedent for this. The decision to not affiliate was my own, so we are following it only by silent consensus, so if you want to change it, be my guest. Calebchiam Talk 04:50, June 18, 2013 (UTC)
It's no biggie and thanks dude :) and sorry if you got too many notifications on your talk page. For some reason, my message kept appearing before Calebchiam's last message. RaghavD Taking the ROAD less travelled 04:56, June 19, 2013 (UTC)

Why is every user on this wiki just ignoring everything I have to say, on talk pages or blog posts? Take your response on to the "fighting" topic, I sent in a response, so did General, and immediately, in the opening, you just addressed General even though I also left a comment. -- ImperiexSeed, 1:51 PM, June 26th 2013

Ok, well....if that truly is the case, I have no problem with that. Oh, I'm sooo looking forward to Season 9, but I'm really curious as to what it's going to be about. -- ImperiexSeed, 12:11 PM, June 27th 2013


Yes, go right ahead. They don't count in the list of article pages anyway, assuming you create them correctly. I've done it here, which would give you this when you search for it. Calebchiam Talk 02:50, June 25, 2013 (UTC)


Hey, I was hoping if you have the time to help me out with an Infobox for a wiki I'm editing.RaghavD Taking the ROAD less travelled 12:50, June 28, 2013 (UTC)

Here's the link to the wiki I've told you about.

See the infobox for the character. I've got the basic template from Community Central. I had to fill up the required details like Ex Partner, Present Partner etc. I did not like the end product of it. I mean the background color of the wiki does not match with the infobox's colors and the color is too light to read. Could you design a template with suitable colors? I mean it's possible to change the colors in the infobox, right? Also I have no idea why is there space between each line. I'm just asking if it's possible for you or not. I would appreciate any help. :) RaghavD Taking the ROAD less travelled 15:25, June 28, 2013 (UTC)

What you have done so far is good. Only one thing left is the width of the infobox. Can that be trimmed?RaghavD Taking the ROAD less travelled 05:01, June 29, 2013 (UTC)

Thanks a lot dude :) I'll let you know if I have any trouble. RaghavD Taking the ROAD less travelled 05:10, June 29, 2013 (UTC)

Eve on the main page[]

Just thought I'd let you know that I added Eve to the main page under Deities. Do you think Lucifer should be added to in the same category as he was the creator of the demons?RaghavD Taking the ROAD less travelled 13:13, July 3, 2013 (UTC)

Yeah. I was talking about the Top of The Main Page. Pardon the turn of phrase :) RaghavD Taking the ROAD less travelled 13:13, July 3, 2013 (UTC)

Alright. I'll think of a way to do that.RaghavD Taking the ROAD less travelled 13:18, July 3, 2013 (UTC)

Done. btw, on the main page there is a slider which consists of 4 images. One of them says that S9 premiere is on Oct 3rd. Anyway to edit that?. I think one has to search for the Slider template of the Supernatural Wiki to edit that.RaghavD Taking the ROAD less travelled 14:48, July 3, 2013 (UTC)

I had to dig a little. But I finished editing it.RaghavD Taking the ROAD less travelled 15:25, July 3, 2013 (UTC)

I don't think the Browse and Slider sections are restricted only to admins. I just searched for the respective templates and edited them. In any case I never really tinkered with templates as a regular user, so I don't know whether anyone can edit them or not.RaghavD Taking the ROAD less travelled 13:39, July 4, 2013 (UTC)

No problem. I took care of it.RaghavD Taking the ROAD less travelled 04:33, July 5, 2013 (UTC)


Hi FTWinchester, the Wiki term for what you are describing is granularity, and for Wikis, the policy we follow is that we create individual pages for all the things within a certain category. It's more practical too, because one isn't going to be able to find what he wants within a page which is a huge long list. At the same time though, the category namesake (e.g. Rituals) will be a general pages that will describe the different types of rituals (Summoning, Warding, etc).

IMO, everything within Supernatural canon is worthy of documentation, even if they appear briefly or in only one episode. More information is always a good thing, after all. Hope this helps. Calebchiam Talk 03:58, July 8, 2013 (UTC)

Great that you noticed it (the Slider thing). I fixed it now.RaghavD Taking the ROAD less travelled 11:35, July 8, 2013 (UTC)

Dude I totally wasn't going to argue with you, just wanted to know. Go ahead and change it back, I was only curious but the first title is absolutely fine :)

Gurgatory (talk) 16:45, July 10, 2013 (UTC)

New Pages[]

If you'd like, you can give me a list of pages you want to create. I would try to collect as much info as I can. I'm a bit free these days, so I took on the task of filling info on the Anime series.RaghavD Taking the ROAD less travelled 05:49, July 16, 2013 (UTC)

For rituals like summoning of Zeus, should there be a separate page like Special Summonings or something like that? or just a separate section in the Summoning page?RaghavD Taking the ROAD less travelled 06:01, July 16, 2013 (UTC)

Wow, that's a lot of rituals for one show. Anyway it is actually a good way to organise the page. On, the other hand, Zeus wasn't the only pagan summoned. I know that novels aren't considered canon, but even Hel was summoned in the latest novel. I was thinking of a page like "Summoning Gods" and add info on both these gods.RaghavD Taking the ROAD less travelled 06:20, July 16, 2013 (UTC)

Yeah, for Hel and all the characters/creatures from the novels. I knew that you created new templates, but I might have missed out on some, because I wasn't aware of the MixedCanon template until now. It actually makes sense, rather than saying that they are outright Non-Canon. The reason is that some of the novels were from Kripke's assistant herself. That is like almost Canon. RaghavD Taking the ROAD less travelled 06:33, July 16, 2013 (UTC)

Sorry. I'm guessing you were just talking about Hel's section on the Summoning Gods page. RaghavD Taking the ROAD less travelled 06:41, July 16, 2013 (UTC)

You are right. I think this warrants for a Summoning Gods page. I will re-watch those episodes and add info accordingly.RaghavD Taking the ROAD less travelled 04:37, July 18, 2013 (UTC)

Seraph Talk Page[]

Why did you remove your comment from the talk page? There was nothing wrong with what you said. RaghavD Born Sinner, the opposite of a Winner 05:34, August 7, 2013 (UTC)

That's true too and I understand your plight very well. RaghavD Born Sinner, the opposite of a Winner 06:07, August 7, 2013 (UTC)

Re: X or Y?[]

Maybe both, I don't know cause they don't come out until October 12, so maybe Christmas? Why are you asking? Pokemonfan201 (talk) 18:32, September 13, 2013 (UTC)

New Spell[]

Hey I re-watched the Taxi Driver episode this afternoon. I noticed that Sam uses an incantation to release Bobby's soul to Heaven. Do you think a page is required? Soul Release Spell sounds a li'l lame. RaghavDAll I need is ONE life, ONE try, ONE breath, I'm ONE man 13:19, September 15, 2013 (UTC)

It's a different one from when Dean released Benny to resurrect him, right? I think it could have its own page (just basing my answer on Caleb's). I'll try to think of something, and I'll tell you if i got a name. I think for now you could start doing the body of the article? FTWinchester (talk) 13:27, September 15, 2013 (UTC)

Yeah, it's a different incantation. I think I'll do it tomorrow morning and drop me a name by then. Or you're welcome to do it. RaghavDAll I need is ONE life, ONE try, ONE breath, I'm ONE man 13:33, September 15, 2013 (UTC)

Sure. Take your time. RaghavDAll I need is ONE life, ONE try, ONE breath, I'm ONE man 13:55, September 15, 2013 (UTC)

Can we talk please, its about your new higher-tier angels catagory, I think you might have been a bit lenient with the description, higher-tier. So why you have the time, I would to chat. General MGD 109 (talk) 17:20, September 21, 2013 (UTC)

How are Esper, Ion, Nathaniel, Virgil higher tier angels? RaghavDAll I need is ONE life, ONE try, ONE breath, I'm ONE man 17:35, September 21, 2013 (UTC)

Seems fair enough. And, good thinking on the Battles category. RaghavDAll I need is ONE life, ONE try, ONE breath, I'm ONE man 05:32, September 22, 2013 (UTC)

It's not a problem. RaghavDAll I need is ONE life, ONE try, ONE breath, I'm ONE man 13:38, September 22, 2013 (UTC)

It's been quite awhile since we last talked, here, on the Supernatural wiki. Relating mostly to the fact that I no longer own my own laptop, so I have to use other resources, like library or my Wii U pad. While excited, I don't understand how it can be beneficial to the story for Lucifer to return, without him extinguishing humans, demons, Angels, etc. There would literally be no story. You take care, bro. -- ImperiexSeed, 12:54 PM, September 23rd 2013

I enjoy the series' Archangels. But, yeah, the Archangels, in who they are, languish everything around them to dust. Speaking on a contextual basis, like I said, there'd be no story with them in it. They bash down any character (besides God and Death) that crosses their path; Angels, demons, Deities, spirits, monsters and humans. -- ImperiexSeed, 10:47 AM, September 26th 2013

Template: Alias[]

I happened to see your message for David. The templates are sysop editable only. For Crowley, you mean that you also want King of Hell to appear? Is that it? RaghavDAll I need is ONE life, ONE try, ONE breath, I'm ONE man 16:22, September 25, 2013 (UTC)

I added it to the Recurring and Minor Characters template. RaghavDAll I need is ONE life, ONE try, ONE breath, I'm ONE man 16:27, September 25, 2013 (UTC)

I was unaware I had, I must have accidentally deleted it when I was clearing up the link problem, sorry. General MGD 109 (talk) 17:08, September 26, 2013 (UTC)

Beast of burden with a beastly question?[]

hay man beast of burden hear just wanna know if there are any pages (apart from kesslerBeast's one) where i can talk to people about future series ideas like possible creatures/Big Bads/plots and other such things if u could let me know that would be realy helpful thanx BTW i have a blog post about the Beast of Revolations (an idea of mine) would u like to check it out up to u lol.

{{SUBST::User:Beast_of_burden/sig_ref}} 05:36, September 30, 2013 (UTC)


thanx for the reply mate didnt think u would lol and dont worry about the long reply its cool lol and i agree with you the shows creatures are kinda bland im actuely sick of angels and demons bring in the ancent things man i liked the leviathens but they ould of been cooler. anyway if u have any ideas for the show and u wanna share them my page is open and if u wanna hear my ideas i think maby we can bounce off each others brainstome :) cool and once agane thanx for replying.

agreed Abbadon and the knights of hell are cool but this guy dosent realy push his ideas dose he lol well hears hopeing :) PLEASE SOMETING NEW!

{{SUBST::User:Beast_of_burden/sig_ref}} 16:54, October 9, 2013 (UTC)

Re: Title Card[]

Yeah, I was trying out the same. I reverted it back. Apparently, I'm not very clear on the exact dimensions of the pic. I'll ask Thesilentpoethosea (previous admin who re-did the theme) for help. RaghavDAll I need is ONE life, ONE try, ONE breath, I'm ONE man 13:59, October 9, 2013 (UTC)

Dude, there nothing to apologize for. RaghavDAll I need is ONE life, ONE try, ONE breath, I'm ONE man 14:08, October 9, 2013 (UTC)

Is it better now? If not, tell me. Should I increase or decrease the transparency? Coz, I can view the pages without any diffivulty, but you never know. RaghavDAll I need is ONE life, ONE try, ONE breath, I'm ONE man 16:49, October 9, 2013 (UTC)

Hyper Links[]

Which color do you think would work for the hyper-links? RaghavDAll I need is ONE life, ONE try, ONE breath, I'm ONE man 15:14, October 10, 2013 (UTC)

I'll use it and let you see for yourself. RaghavDAll I need is ONE life, ONE try, ONE breath, I'm ONE man 04:08, October 11, 2013 (UTC)

I do not know it. Guess you'll have to check it on the internet for the nearest approximation. RaghavDAll I need is ONE life, ONE try, ONE breath, I'm ONE man 12:35, October 16, 2013 (UTC)

Re: Lilith as Big Bad[]

Don't sweat it, dude. Happens to everyone. By the way, what'd you think of the last episode?--NaiflidG (talk) 16:39, October 18, 2013 (UTC)

I thought it was much better, too (probably 'cause it had way more action than the premiere--I loved Abaddon equipping her demons with guns, that was so cool). Yeah, the wings thing didn't make much sense, but I'm willing to gloss over that because the skeletal burnt wing shot looked badass. My problems with the episode are with Abaddon. Like you said, she was scared of facing one fallen angel, and also A.) why did she torture the hunters for information when she can read minds, and B.) doesn't she know where the bunker is, since she was in the room when Larry gave Sam the coordinates and she could have looked at them when Sam was unconscious? Even though she had no way of knowing Crowley was there, she could have gone and tried to either break in or launch some kind of attack on Sam and Dean. But, all in all, I did like the episode. Hope we get more awesome moments like it.--NaiflidG (talk) 17:19, October 18, 2013 (UTC)

It could also have been that Abaddon had time to kill and decided to spend it by torturing the information out of hunters (which would also have the bonus of making them feel guilty after they break), so she could have just been in a sadistic mood. Or she was testing her new soldiers' interrogation skills. Good point with the bunker, but since the Titan and his kid and Castiel got in last year, and they had already brought Crowley in, I wasn't sure if the writers remembered that it's supposed to be warded. If there's no follow-up to either point for the rest of the season, I'll assume that the writers forget or just found it easier to write the story a particular way.--NaiflidG (talk) 17:53, October 18, 2013 (UTC)


Hey, yeah I'm still active in there, just not editing that much anymore Damon-Balthazar-Salvatore (talk) 16:47, October 18, 2013 (UTC)

My apoligizes friend, I've been on what you might call an EXTENDED vacation but Ive recently returned to this wiki when i received your message from July. I assume all is taken care of now? also I see there have been MANY changes around here lol.(talk)--Bkshadows

Not a big deal friend, if it means that much to you ill undo your creations when i have a chance. That was just to get rid of those black borders dont know why there's so many? but there was nothing "wrong" with your photos dont take it personal. and no there is no standard size for a wiki picture. because I'm in film school I love paying such attention to detail such as the props they use and the Computer Generated Effects. When I first started here it drove me INSANE to try and view a picture with small dimensions, too many pixels or just low quality. I then took it upon myself to replace these with higher quality ones just to give the viewer a better picture. Its just a small habit Ive kept up around here as you can see. (talk)--Bkshadows

May we all not be scorched. ha ha[]

Many characters say, in Season 5, that together, Michael and Lucifer would devastate a third of the Earth. However, Zachariah says that if Lucifer goes on check, he'll roast every single human to 'flakes of oblivion.' I was wondering, do you think I should post this on pyrokinesis's page or no? Is this assertion enough evidence. I, personally, believe that the Devil is powerful enough to tear apart continents. Catch you around, bud. -- ImperiexSeed, 11:54 PM, October 30th 2013

My goodness, that section on God's page really has gotten bigger, ornated into the form of a mashed block. I'll read it and when I have time, I'll fix it. -- ImperiexSeed, 3:25 PM, November 22nd 2013

I hear what your saying[]

I hear what your saying, but still he had clearly gone somewhere of the deep end, somewhere along the road he went from eating dead animal parts as part of a spell, to being willing to murder when he didn't need to, to being willing to outright murder and eat a person, I wouldn't say he was really that sane. Still your right, it did make him more predatory, its just in human terms that sort of predatory is closer to a psychopath. General MGD 109 (talk) 22:43, November 6, 2013 (UTC)

Template:D deletion[]

I really didn't check it before deleting. It wasn't appropriately named and thought that it was one of those templates that were unused. From now on, I'll check twice before going on a deleting spree. RaghavD'"I'm beginning to feel like a Rap God" 09:40, November 8, 2013 (UTC)

A Quick Question[]

That kind of thought never even crossed my mind, buddy. Don't even think about it anymore. RaghavD'"I'm beginning to feel like a Rap God" 15:45, November 27, 2013 (UTC)

Did Sam have super-strength?[]

I think Sam had a discrete level of super-strength, at times, while he was on demon blood - given the implications through a quote by Dean, when he said, "You're not hopped up on demon blood this time" when they were about to physically fight. Just something to think about. -- ImperiexSeed, 9:00 PM, November 27th 2013

Yes, I think he did. I remember that my brother and I kept a close tab on the fights of Sam and Dean, and Sam usually won especially around season 4, when he was high with demon blood. FTWinchester (talk) 06:08, November 28, 2013 (UTC)

Please go to blog The oldest being, archangel or leviathan? and read and respond to my latest comment. I can't believe how anyone, from any standpoint, can think Leviathans stand even a remote chance to the power of archangels. One archangel could take 100 "gods," 5 Leviathans and dragons in an instant. Leviathans, in some form or another, require a level of sustenance while archangels can survive indefinitely without touching food. Archangels can create blizzards, heat waves, tornadoes, tsunamis, etc. Lucifer dug 600 ft to the core of the Earth without breaking a sweat, he annihilated ancient "gods" effortlessly, and they can resurrect another being again and again till the end, while simultaneously doing other things. Imagine that; resurrecting the dead endlessly while also teleporting, talking, etc. They have no equal in the show besides God and Death. -- ImperiexSeed, 6:47 PM, December 1st 2013
So, what do you think? Please, respond to my message above. There really should be NO controversy regarding archangels and every other character/creature, but God and Death. They win decillions times over. -- ImperiexSeed, 12:24 PM, December 9th 2013
Proof? Seriously?! Isn't archangels' appearances enough? My most wildest imaginations couldn't conjure a scenario where a Leviathan could defeat an archangel. An archangel blade, you say? Ok, first off, they'd never get the chance to effectively use it. Before the armed Leviathan could even move, the blade would be as ash at their feet. What, from their side, could Leviathans possibly do to in any way to deter an archangel? With a flick of the wrist, an archangel could hurl a Leviathan to a storm of cosmic butterflies, completely incinerating both the vessel and the Leviathan. They could smother one to death in a mountain of sneakers. The archangel could strike them with lightning for 9 hours till the Leviathan's a sizzling corpse. -- ImperiexSeed, December 12th 2013
Really? So is believing a shapeshifter who hasn't appeared yet can shapeshift (without actually seeing it specifically do it) headcanon? But thanks for all your opinions and feedback. -- ImperiexSeed, 11:47 PM, December 13th 2013

Hey, would it be safe to say that with multiple angels, it's possible to tear into supernatural dimensions (seen with Purgatory)? On a totally different note, do you think that we'll get to see some archangels (Lucifer and or Gabriel)? I love archangels but, with them, there's no story. Dean, Sam, Castiel, Bobby, Ellen and Jo couldn't hurt, affect or touch Lucifer for practically the whole season. This is an inevitability that can't be altered when concerning archangels. Anyway, catch you around, buddy. ImperiexSeed, 11:02 PM, December 15th 2013

Hey. Are you done talking to me, or are you just busy? I'd appreciate some kind of response to the above message. Alright, hope to catch you around. -- ImperiexSeed, 1:14 PM, December 17th 2013

I know, but you must realize, eventually, doing nine seasons (and probably a tenth), they're going to run out of avenues, leading to an unavoidable halt. I myself am enjoying this season. Again, with a totally different note, why do users call God the creator of 'the universe?' He's clearly not in Supernatural; he didn't create Death, Famine, War, Pestilence, "gods", and probably not reapers (who were presumably created by Death). -- ImperiexSeed, 6:02 PM, December 17th 2013

They've managed to keep this story from crumbling so far, even with some things that don't make sense to me. I can't begin to list reasons why having an angel (now seraph) close friend puts entire arcs at disadvantages and skews logic. Take every time someone's died, for example. I don't know why Dean, Sam and even Bobby haven't used Castiel to do so much good. He could resurrect John, Mary, Karen, Ellen, Jo, Rufus, Will, Charlie's mom, etc. Not to mention every single hunt they go on; they'd save a lot of time and lives by asking Castiel to take care the evils (ghouls, vampires, wendigos, werewolves, maybe wiping out thousands of demons at a time) in Supernatural. And yet, they're still kickin' evil's gnarly ass. ImperiexSeed, 7:55 PM, December 17th 2013
I personally like season 9, probably for reasons you don't. I attest, Castiel intervening every time would wrinkle the story to the point of futility, but it'll never chuck the fact of strict cogency, where it makes no sense that these characters wouldn't use Castiel to do all those good things I mentioned. You can't be serious about angels always being epitomized as bright gleams? How can that work with multiple angels being demonstrated, like in "Holy Terror?" I'd be bemused if they tried to demonstrate multiple angels at once with bright gleams. So, they chose the grace to typify the angels' presences. -- ImperiexSeed, 3:37 PM, December 19th 2013
I guess it could work if they showed light spraying from multiple vantage points. -- ImperiexSeed, 3:06 PM, December 20th 2013

Michael Photo[]

Sure, I'll try Gabriel456 (talk) 23:58, December 15, 2013 (UTC)

Huh. Tried increasing the photo's size abit, but the preview still showed Michael/John being weird compared to Michael/Adam. This may be because they're both in the same photo. I guess I'll have to post two seperate pictures, see if that works Gabriel456 (talk) 00:04, December 16, 2013 (UTC)

How's that, any better? Gabriel456 (talk) 00:07, December 16, 2013 (UTC)

nah, don't worry about it, it's not a bother Gabriel456 (talk) 00:13, December 16, 2013 (UTC)

Re:Orphan Pages and Dead ends[]

Dead-end pages simply mean that they don't link to any other articles - which is not great since all the articles in the Wiki ought to be connected such that it's literally impossible to reach a dead end. Orphan pages have no pages linking to them, which means they can only be found by the search bar - again, not great. There are no official policies since there don't really need to be; we just ought to avoid such pages by creating more links between articles.

Granularity again, I'm quite for it since by having more articles, it makes it more likely that others will expand said articles. That being said, the argument from the other side that some topics have so little information that it only makes sense to group them together is logical as well. So..the former might be preferable, but the latter is sometimes necessary. You will have to use your discretion on this. Cheers! Calebchiam Talk 15:59, December 17, 2013 (UTC)


You said you might be leaving depending on where the rest of season 9 goes. Um, a friend's coming to pick me up, like now, but I'd really like to talk with you about this. Not to try an change your mind, that's not my place at all, but maybe meet you on chat when we're both on. But, if and when you do leave, I'll miss you a lot. Catch you later, buddy. -- ImperiexSeed, 1:51 PM, December 27th 2013

I started watching the show back in 2008, with "The Rapture," and immediately I was hooked. I caught up quickly after that, to where I've seen every episode of every season. I, to date, really enjoy their incorporation of angel/demon lore, no matter where it goes (archangels, Rit Zien, especially the cupid), but I do care about the story. Like I said in a different message, if they branch out, and lather other lore into the story, it will eventually stop making sense (such as the Castiel thing I mentioned). Sera's Bigger and Bad(der) thing can only hold for so long till it becomes impossibly unfair for the boys. Ok, my question to you is, where should they go? They only have so many arteries. -- ImperiexSeed, 4:18 PM, December 29th 2013

The Horsemen's rings?[]

Who/what forged the four Horsemen rings? The better questions is, who would create such objects? I know this wasn't dabbed at in the show, but I'd like to hear some of your thoughts. Did they just appear when the Horsemen took on form? Were they forged in the supernatural fires of hell? Were they just Earthly rings, maybe like Death's cane and Famine's wheelchair, which changed on contact with the Horsemen?

About the last message...[]

I'm sorry for making you going crazy...I am new here and what I wrote on your page yesterday, well, it seemed to be holy crap. So I removed it :D My English is pretty horrible and the structure of this wiki is different from the German one...

But I think it although would be funny to "talk" to you guys here :) so forget about that, please.

C U Jo ;D

See? I forgot My sign. (Joanna Beth Harvelle (talk) 14:29, January 2, 2014 (UTC))

Just a few things.[]

I can easily assume that Crowley's going to use the angel exorcising spell, you know, the one not seen since frickin' four! Or, he might just torture the angel out of him. Why didn't Alastair unleash Death and use him to bend practically everything in the powers of hell favor? Such power would've allowed them to win the war a hundred times over. Death, now operating under the whim of crazy Al, could've slaughtered every opposing angel, raised every deceased demon (even ones from the primeval age), snatch his master (Lucifer) out of the cage without having to go through the seals. Then again, Alastair would probably find that immensely boring and not as satisfying as maiming and torturing everyone he can with his own vessel's hands. Also, why didn't Lucifer use the four Horsemen rings during the apocalypse? He could worn them on his vessel's fingers, and bear the power to manipulate the very aspects of war, famine, pestilence and death. He would've been more powerful than even Castiel when he had all of Purgatory's souls. -- ImperiexSeed, 1:49 PM, January 2nd 2014

Well, actually, Death has the power to raise anything organic, living, or active back to a state of consciousness. Because he's Death. So, he can raise deceased demons, because according to Cas and Crowley, archangels can raise deceased demons. -- ImperiexSeed, 6:38 PM, January 3rd 2014
Cite them? Are you serious? Fine. There was an episode, in season six, where Castiel says, "We'll [angels and demons] die again and again till the end of time." This means archangels can resurrect deceased angels and demons. Also, Rapahel said Lucifer could resurrect deceased angels. Crowley makes a similar remark in "The Devil You Know." So, if archangels can, Death can too. -- ImperiexSeed, 11:19 PM, January 3rd 2014
After Lucifer dug the hole, he started changing and then, Death manifested himself in front of Lucifer. And so, I thought if they (Castiel and Lucifer) used the same words, then it is, in fact, a manifestations spell. -- ImperiexSeed, 12:02 AM, January 4th 2014

Manifestation spell[]

Can I add a page regarding the manifestation spell Castiel used to make the cupid find form, which actually, could be the same spell used by Lucifer on Death. - ImperiexSeed, 10:22 PM, January 3rd 2014

Hey, is something going on with you and I? I feel drowned in silence. Are you, in any way, mad at me? We've been a good streak for a while now. If not, I see no point in ruffling anything any further. Anyway, if anything, I softly correlated spells used by Castiel and Lucifer in those two instances. Thought something was there, however they could just as easily possess no correlation in relation to the result of the spell. A Horseman's ring, worn, is shown to operate in such a way that the wearer is endowed with infinite dominance over the said attribute. But, anyway, I'll catch you later. -- ImperiexSeed, 9:13 PM, January 11th 2014

Thank you, bro, for getting back to me. Please understand if this message is sloppy, it's late and I'm beat. I was referring to what they said in Latin - and if it matched up. And, if they did, then both would be a type of manifestation spell. -- ImperiexSeed, 12:10 AM, January 12th 2014

I'm really offended that you're not responding to any of my comments on talk pages. I need you to level with me on this one. Especially the one you requested that I commented on. What's going on here, man? And not seeing the feed isn't really an excuse, seeing as you can just scroll down. Alright, have a good one, buddy. -- ImperiexSeed, 6:04 PM, January 12th 2014

That makes sense. I'll try to keep that in mind. Alright, so that depends on how you define focus. In the show, it appeared to more regulate their powers than anything else, and Dean was able to access pretty much every power and ability in Death's arsenal (death tap, teleportation, etc). So, I'd say, theoretically, if Dean tried on War's ring, he'd get all of the Horseman's power. -- ImperiexSeed, 6:41 PM, January 12th 2013

Hello again :D[]

So, if I got that right, English isn't your native language? Well, maybe you agree in that point when I say it's almost demanding to communicate in another language ^^

I noticed the popularity of this wiki and I'm confused about all the extra stuff you've got here! But i like the German wiki better, cuz it's German xD in the rankings there I'm the 9th place! but I think it's much smaller than "yours". i mean, we've got about 500 articles and here are more than 1.500!

key, I'm getting out know (Joanna Beth Harvelle (talk) 21:45, January 5, 2014 (UTC))

Re: Apocrypha[]

'Kay. Forgive me for pestering you about this, but what is your stance on the canonicity of the guides? It seemed like you supported them as canon (so long as there aren't any glaring contradictions) due to the Astaroth thing, but you also said that the TV show should be our only standard for canon. Should I count you as being for or against their being included as canon (or neutral)? In the meantime, thanks for a lively and thought-provoking debate (and for being the only person so far to give their thoughts on the matter). Peace out.--NaiflidG (talk) 00:52, January 10, 2014 (UTC)

Hey, good for you, man! I'm glad it brightened your day. Did you find anything particularly interesting so far? Also, unless you have other Companion Guides, I think that this means we both have the Season 7 Companion and The Essential Supernatural (I've also got three of the novels and the first issue of one of the comics--I should probably add information on them, but that sounds like more of a project for when we're on hellatus and now it's only a couple days 'till the current one is over--maybe over the summer). When opportunity arises to get another, I think I'll get the fourth season guide, just because it's supposed to have something in it comparing the general power levels between white-eyed and yellow-eyed demons (and because Season 4 was probably my favorite season and had some of my favorite supporting characters in it, so it might have some really interesting stuff). Which one do you think you want next?--NaiflidG (talk) 05:38, January 12, 2014 (UTC)

Yeah, I'd love to Season 3 and Season 6 Guides, too. Come to think of it, the Season 8 Companion might also be super-interesting, especially if it has information about the Knights of Hell and the revised hierarchy of Hell (that is, with the Knights of Hell having been created) as of the end of Season 8. It might be easier just to say that it'd be neat to have all the Guides. The novels are kind of crappy in my opinion; of the three I have, I like Night Terror the best because it's got some carnage and chaos on an epic scale they'd never manage on TV (like, there's this scene where a guy gets trapped in the sidewalk or something and a gigantic spider half-melts him with acid and eats his head), but it seemed like there were too many side-characters and not enough focus on the Winchesters themselves. Coyote's Kiss would've been really cool except it focused too much on this OC character and her relationship with Dean with Sam kind of just standing there, and One Year Gone also would've been pretty cool (and offered some background on the Campbell family being at Salem and Soulless Sam's time with the Campbells and stuff) but was just kind of clumsily-executed and had these spelling errors that shouldn't have been there that detracted from my enjoyment of it. And the Aswang sound cool as hell from their page on this wiki; now I kind of want the book, too. Anything interesting from John Winchester's Journal and Bobby Singer's Guide to Hunting? I like the reveal that Ruby was a double-agent because I prefer demons to be pure evil and scheme-y rather than having any speck of good in them, but she was killed off way too soon--she should've stuck around at least through Season 5, just to see her working against the Winchesters and how they react to each other now that the fact she's been tricking them is out in the open (plus, maybe she could've worked with Meg and that would've been fun to see). And we should have gotten the Harvelles in Seasons 3 and 4 (even if it was just to make us get more attached to them so that their deaths in "Abandon All Hope..." would be all the more shocking). Don't even get me started on Anna; I'm still annoyed that the Winchesters apparently never wondered where their other angel ally was for most of Season 5 and that she's villified for trying to save the world after months of non-stop torture and brainwashing (even though Dean tortured other souls in Hell because he'd been tortured himself for so long and Castiel slaughtered thousands and brought the leviathan onto Earth to stop the Apocalypse and killed Samandiriel under brainwashing, yet there's no question of forgiving them) while Gabriel did far worse for much less noble reasons but he is seen as a good guy and mourned and is now apparently coming back to life. /rant--NaiflidG (talk) 19:27, January 12, 2014 (UTC)

Dunno if you've been on lately, dude, but it looks like we finally got our answer for the great Azazel vs. Lilith debate. Hope that you are doing well.--NaiflidG (talk) 18:21, September 1, 2014 (UTC)

Re: Deal[]

Oh, cool. I think there is a difference with regards to proper deals and simple agreements (like the difference between Dean selling his soul to get Sam back and his agreeing to hand Henry and the box over to Abaddon to get Sam back). Proper deals have to be sealed in some way to ensure that neither party go back on their word, whereas you're operating purely on trust with just agreements. The thing that confuses me is what the repercussion of breaking a proper deal is, what keeps a demon from just going against their word in the first place--are they just magically forced to obey their deal or is there something negative that happens to them as a result of going against their deals? It seems that the crossroads demons are just afraid of Crowley punishing them for potentially costing them more souls if word gets out that they're double-crossing clients and you're fully capable of breaking deals if you like and you have the contract in-hand, but I kind of got the impression when Castiel double-crossed Crowley that you're just plain not supposed to go against your deal ("Even I don't break a deal like this" or something) and what's the point of having a magically-binding contract in the first place if you can just break it on a whim?--NaiflidG (talk) 18:53, January 12, 2014 (UTC)

Leviathans....eating in....Heaven?[]

I really can't understand the end part of this sentence, which is located on the Angels' page: Sometime after God and Death's existence, God creates Heaven. He later creates the first beasts, the Leviathans, and let them roam Heaven, eating and devouring everything in their path. What, exactly, were Leviathans eating in heaven? Nothing existed at this time besides God and Death (who, obviously, weren't being munched on by Leviathan). Were they plowing through each other and caused so much damage to both themselves and heaven, that God had no choice but to lock them somewhere to ensure the safety of the universe at large? Unless furthered and revealed in a future episode, it stands to be inevitably impossible for there to be any other explanation than the one I just gave. Literally, nothing existed at that time besides God and Death, which it shouldn't even be said that God and Death couldn't be at all scathed by them because of how obvious it is.-- ImperiexSeed, 8:31 PM, January 13th 2014

That still doesn't answer what they could've been eating in heaven, but that's alright I guess. It's really important to look at how Death phrased his question of, Why do you think he created Purgatory? To keep those poisonous things out. Notice he didn't say "Why do you think God changed Purgatory" (which, no offense, automatically destroys the idea that God created Purgatory anyway besides the way it looked when he imprisoned them there) or "To keep them in." (which means he sent them there and that they weren't living there and he just changed it) -- ImperiexSeed, 3:09 PM, January 14th 2014
I don't understand how it could be different than God created it. I'm going off what Death say and going from there. I really appreciate your trying to help me here with all theses ideas, but I am looking at this simplistically, and not jump to all these hazy assumptions that could possibly be true in a certain light under certain circumstances. You know? This 'new Earth' concept has never been dabbed at anywhere in what we know as canon, but yours ideas could be potentially possible, which I find highly complicated next to Death's simple question and statement regarding this. -- ImperiexSeed, 3:23 PM, January 14th 2014

Can Leviathan actually mimic the physiologies of other beings?[]

In "There Will Be Blood," a Leviathan touches a vampire's arm and bears the fangs of a vampire. It seems inarguable that this means they can mimic or copy other beings' physiologies and theoretically gain their abilities. Or can they simply mimic the appearance of any given physical being? What did you think it meant when this happened? If true, this would then make them the most dangerous threat the Winchesters have ever faced. -- ImperiexSeed, 10:38 PM, January 14th 2014

Really? What scene are you on, then? The scene I'm talking about is where Edgar touches a vampire and takes his form then bears the fangs of a vampire. -- ImperiexSeed, 11:13 PM, January 14th 2014
I'm talking about mimicking abilities not skills. I've now come to recognize that we view things differently because, again, I'm looking at actions or comments at face value, instead of complicating things by, for instance, limiting an ability (shapeshifting by contact) that has been established to work one way variably regarding several points. In other words, they, on at least two occasions, have been able to mimic the physicality of any creature that they've touched. To say they can do this with angels, is technically unproven or even hinted at. But speculatively, it can be argued that when Edgar killed the two angels by contact, he didn't have any need to mimic the angels' powers. I hope you enjoyed "Road Trip" and that maybe somehow you're going to stick it out. See ya, buddy. -- ImperiexSeed, 11:39 PM, January 14th 2014
This is where it gets a little mucky. The timing to take things at face value and not fluctuate greatly. You did there, yes, but archangels have proven to be exceptionally strong for beings angels, especially in a comparison between Leviathan. Castiel repeatedly spoke of the sheer impossibility of the task of killing Lucifer was, for it only became possible if Michael stepped in. The only way he was defeated without any action from Michael, was because they teased his pride by giving him Sam as a vessel. Now, no one can cite where it's said in the series that archangels can kill/beat Leviathan or vice-versa. And depending on whether or not Leviathan can mimic angels, I hold inscrutable amount of confidence that Leviathan can't beat archangels. I'll try an stop dumping all my ideas or questions on you and give you some time to edit and have fun. But, later, I will send you messages when I have something I'd like to discuss. -- ImperiexSeed, 12:25 AM, 15th 2014
It depends on how you're looking at this. Although, point of view is rightly disposed of in comparison to facts. I'll use an example of a subject we're already talking about. One can say, Leviathan can kill archangels, which is baseless where there's insurmountable hints pointing the contrary. Archangels can destroy Leviathan in an instant from a long distance. You're right, the bone weapon is the only know conventional way to kill Leviathan, but that's nothing impressive when archangels can only be killed conventionally with a certain weapon. Like I said in the previous message, Lucifer was unbeatable unless Michael stepped in, and was only defeated without action from Michael because they teased his pride by giving him Sam as a vessel. While it hasn't been seen on the show, it's damn frickin' obvious whatever Leviathan touch they can mimic their physicality and, by turn, their abilities. The abilities part is more a theory, I'll admit, but it seems like they can mimic their abilities based on what is seen in "There Will Be Blood." Now, the writers could've messed up what they were trying represent in this scene. But, generally, whatever the writers say, in regards to the show, is canon unless it's in direct contradiction with other information. Um, I'll concede it's what you call a no-win relating to Leviathan capability of mimicking angel physiologies. -- ImperiexSeed, 6:07 PM, January 15th 2014
It's stilling. There won't ever be any form of confirmation or be dabbled in the show between archangels and Leviathan. But, anyway. It's been dropped. Take care, buddy. -- ImperiexSeed, 10:25 PM, January 15th 2014

Archangels require conventional means to kill the Knights of Hell? What???[]

That is the farthest stretch I think I've ever seen any of the writers take. Archangels need a weapon to kill the Knights of Hell (a type of demon, mind you) and not bypass such a parameter with simple evisceration?! It's like saying archangels would require a machete to kill vampires. I could, and should, go on and on about this one but, for your sake and sanity, I won't. ;) That probably wouldn't have settled well with Kripke, I would assume. Besides that, "First Born" was an amazing episode. -- ImperiexSeed, 10:30 PM, January 21st 2014

Yeah, I think it's probably more the fact that Cain decided to kill the Knights himself before archangels decided to do it themselves. FTWinchester (talk) 03:39, January 22, 2014 (UTC)

Can we, please, lock the Colt page for a while? I just reverted an edit that didn't possess a tad bit of relevance to what's been revealed in canon. The user said archangels, Horsemen, Leviathans/Eve, Cain and deities were the five things Lucifer was talking about. No character has been revealed, besides Lucifer, to possess immunity to the Colt. So, to name off characters other than him is dishonest. Just to give you a level of absurdity of their claims. They also said that only God and possibly Death's Scythe can kill Horsemen. I doubt God could kill the Horsemen apart from wiping out their attributes. Even God, with unlimited power, can't kill Horsemen while their attributes still exist. It's impossible. I've been weirdly patience on this, it's time to lock it until users stop drenching the page in speculation. -- ImperiexSeed, 6:39 PM, January 22nd 2014

It's me again[]

Yeah, I'm still alive! Haha, sry. Well... after all the time i've got a question, or more...

If you know how to summon a demon, why don't ya say it?

I mean, I would catch the demon in a devils trap. (of course) Then I would make him weak with holy water. I'd ask him questions about all the supernatural creatures on earth. If he could destroy everything what kills innocent people, wouldn't you sell you're soul?

If he cannot, i would sent him back to hell. No prob ;)

What would you do, if you're albe to summon a demon?

And please keep in mind: it's just imagination.

CU Jo ;D -> Joanna Beth Harvelle (talk) 15:06, January 25, 2014 (UTC)


Copying text word for word is plagarism. The entries I commented on we made by me on the, and i certainly didn't post them here, someone else cut and paste them. I would suggest this site needs to remind contributers that plagasim is wrong. Missyjack (talk) 00:02, January 27, 2014 (UTC)

Re: Need policing[]

I guess that this issue's resolved. If you haven't noticed already, I'm not active as I've got exams and would probably not check the site for about 2 weeks. So contact Imperiex for any problem. Cheerio! RaghavD'"Look into my eyes. It’s where my demons hide" 11:19, January 28, 2014 (UTC)

I do not wish to see a demon, they could be much more strong than I think, but

I still remember, that Supernatural could be just the idea... so it isn't bad to have fun with friends. Don'tya think it's part of it that you vie with your friends who does know the most and strangest things from spn? :D haha, yeah, I know... I'm a little bit strange :)

And please answer my questions?! xD Seeya ;D Joanna Beth Harvelle (talk) 16:41, January 28, 2014 (UTC)

Maybe he/she likes that picture with Castiel and Uriel in vessels, but regardless, we're finally given an infinitesimal snapshot of their wings in season nine. Which, though wobbly, is better than using vessels now that we can use the other one. Plus, there are plenty of places where their picture can fit, like you pointed out. Thanks for contacting me, I did what I can. I couldn't bring myself to just come in and whack them with a block, so I saddled the problem with respect, giving them one last reminder to either stop or that I'll be forced to block them. -- ImperiexSeed, 3:44 PM, January 28th 2014

no idea how to do the things "i plan" for?

i do not plan it, my dear! its just imagination like: what would happen if...

well, forget about that. you're filipino and live... um, where? america i think ^^ hm, how many episodes of spn did you watched? :D i'm a miserable spn fan... just season 1 and about seven episodes season 7! :O i have to learn much more about this world ;D Joanna Beth Harvelle (talk) 16:05, January 29, 2014 (UTC)

The Colt page is now locked. If you want to do something to the page, contact me, and I'll momentarily unlock it for you to do your edit and get out. Because there is no character, besides Lucifer, that anyone could name that is not, at this time, speculative. God and Death aren't apart of creation and Death is invincible or regenerative to such a degree that the Colt is just as effective as being jabbed with a grain of sand, and God is incontrovertibly unaffected by the Colt. -- ImperiexSeed, 3:57 PM, January 29th 2014

Do you think Lucifer will really be returning this season? It'd be really cool, but I doubt it. Archangel appearances, in any quantity, practically make it impossible for the arc or story to finagle around them. I'm not really getting any impression that Lucifer will be returning, or am I missing something? How could he get out of the cage, is the first question? Outside from any outer inference, it's impossible, am I wrong? I'm also bewildered how there would be any story left if he did return. -- ImperiexSeed, 10:39 PM, January 29th 2014

I guess the writers could goes against everything on Kripke's cage and make a way for Metatron to open the cage, without the Horsemen rings. There could be something regarding the workings of the "gogs" of the cage on the Angel tablet, I suppose. -- ImperiexSeed, 10:52 PM, January 29th 2014

Last time I forgot the title ^^[]

So, Canada? Tell me! Weather, your family, school... TV! xD haha sry

Is the show you recommended quite great as supernatural? Well, i'll try to watch it after i've done spn. but i guess i won't find any episodes in germany so it'll be hard for me to understand.

Do ya want to know something about Germany and the German people?

I'm a little bit afraid... on the next thursday i've got oral exams for English! I think my English is pretty bad, but let's see... There's a chance not to fail! :D haha key bye Joanna Beth Harvelle (talk) 21:06, January 30, 2014 (UTC)


Been awhile. How you doing? Also when you have the time, can you help to with the blog. If your confused about it the tread comments between General and Imperiex and me explain it better. Thanks.00:45, February 1, 2014 (UTC)[[User:Twilight Despair 5|]] ([[The God of Creation]]) (talk)

Td5 on mobile. I was wondering if you saw the reply, on the blog on our tread? I am still going to type this story up. Just waiting for all the pieces to match. 23:34, February 19, 2014 (UTC)

Very interesting![]

Okay I think that about my English was a compliment, if not: i don't care ;D

Yeah, the last winter was also in Germany a torture. First snow in November, cold temperatures, snow and ice until April?! That was CREEPY!

But today I'm pretty cool about the oral exams next week. Well, my vocabulary isn't that big but it's enough for school ^^ hope i'll learn a little bit more in our conversation :D

So many shows! Wow, I've got lots of work to do xD

What for music do you listen to? I love some bands like Linkin Park, One Republic, Coldplay and so on. Ariana Grande, Macklemore...

There are so many more artists i love! Lindsey Stirling is cool because she unites classic and the charts <3 i love that! But i also listen to piano (versions). Do you like Pirates of the Caribbean? I love the score :D and the movie... xD

Oh my Gee, could write the whole day! But i think it's best for me to stop now. I'm meeting a friend in 30 minutes, so at 15 ó clock xD is that right? ó clock? i've learned that in the primary school; so long ago ^^

Do you know how the school running looks like in germany? I could try to explain but if you already know i can leave that out :D

have to go, seeya Joanna Beth Harvelle (talk) 13:33, February 1, 2014 (UTC)

==11 ó clock and I had no breakfast yet. WTH? ==

Buffy the vampire slayer, right? You seem to want me watch that. Key, I'm working on it :D (<- Deans quote xD)

We've got a primary school with four years. Then you got something like a assessment or a recommendation (=eine Empfehlung). Because there are more types of schools and the teachers decide, what would be the best for you.

Hauptschule - For fools; Realschule - not that stupid, but no genius; Gymnasium - quite intelligent :D; Gemeinschaftsschule - something between Realschule and Gymnasium

I learned in school that gymnasium or gym means a sports hall, funny!? ^^

After the Grundschule = Primary school you go on counting with year 5! I think my school goes until year 13, so I am 8 years at a Gymnasium. That is called G8, so eight years on the Gymnasium.

What nobody needs: The years on the Gymnasium are counted in the Latin way but in the other way around?!

Year 5: VI = Sexta

6: V = Quinta

7: IV = Quarta

8: (now it gets difficult!) U III = Unter (/ Under-)tertia

9: O III = Ober(/ Upper-)tertia

10: U II = Untersecunda

11: O II =Obersecunda - and I'm not sure how it goes on, but it's strange, isn't it?

Okey, I guess you're a little bit confused now, but i hope it doesn't sound so complicated. CU Joanna Beth Harvelle (talk) 11:57, February 2, 2014 (UTC)

oh, now it's 12:57...

Angel feathers can be tangibly handled by man?[]

Wow, I guess even the writers can mess with the impossible and somehow make it possible in the show. I didn't know anyone could assort such a plain impossibility, like ever. "As Times Goes By," we see Henry sorting through some items, one being feathers of some type of angel. Correct if I'm wrong, but being physical creatures, it's impossible for humans to handle the spiritual in any sense. By definition, anything spiritual is beyond the realm of physical contact. Every time an angel dies in a vessel on a surface, it leaves physical remnants of the ashes of their wings. Do your ol' buddy a favor, and clear this up for me. I would monumentously appreciate any kind of direction on this one. -- ImperiexSeed, 6:28 PM, February 4th 2014

That line of logic is like saying it's in any way possible to make an ear not an ear. -- ImperiexSeed, 6:54 PM, February 4th 2014

The tender brotherhood between Dean and Sam.[]

I could spend days explaining the love held by Dean and Sam, but I'll just give you a mini snippet. Every animal in the world, combined, pails in comparison to the magnitude of Dean and Sam's relationship. At least through, I'd say, season six, Dean would lunge at death to save Sam, as would Sam for Dean. Now, as of season nine, as revealed in "The Purge," Sam has admitted that he wouldn't try an reverse, undo, or change Dean's death if he died. In a way, this shows that Sam has learned that doing absolutely anything to cheat death is dangerous and racks up a ton of casualties. But this also made me cry, because it shows just how much their relationship has changed. Without the relationship between Dean and Sam, this show would lose all sense of meaning and heart. Your thoughts? -- ImperiexSeed, 12:14 AM, February 5th 2014

Oh, you didn't miss much, believe me. It was probably the most bizarre episode I've ever seen in any episode in supernatural, and a waste of my time besides the the brothers pepping each other at the end, quite frankly. I'd, on my end, say no. If we left it at "Swan Song," Bobby would be dead, Sam would be imprisoned in the cage theoretically forever, and Castiel would be dead as well. -- ImperiexSeed, 10:45 AM, February 7th 2014

I haven't seen the episode in a while and got a lot of it mixed up, so forgive me if you can. And one could say Sam being soulless is retecon compensation for the next idea of the next season. -- ImperiexSeed, 9:29 PM, February 8th 2014

Sorry for answering that late :/[]

I don't know why, but there wasn't any sign that you answered...

I think i could do research about the latin numbers in school... cuz it's really strange and now i want to know why!

Yeah, Schule means school. And I think some german words are holy shit. I'm sorry for that, but... oh! There are videos made about that, so you can watch them. but some of them are parody, then please do not think we are that rude, okey?

Just the word Deutschland sounds so ugly! Our ancestors were called Die Germanen and i wonder how it became die Deutschen in Deutschland?!

Well, you can change the school if your school report is good enough for a better one! But if you are on a Gymnasium [ güm na si um not Jimnäisium ;)] and you are too bad for it, you repeat the year or worse: you go on a Gemeinschafts- or Realschule. It's not like you are all the time on the same school. Optimally you are, but you have not to stay.

If you're supposed to go on a Hauptschule and you want to go on a Gymnasium, i think they wouldn't let you in. :D

Have to do homework, bye! Joanna Beth Harvelle (talk) 16:49, February 8, 2014 (UTC)

Ok, now I'm going to get involved. Sorry man for interrupting, but this user has needs to understand something. Now while you're not disrespecting or anything like that, and I'm not admonishing you (well, not yet), but talk pages (as far as I'm concerned) are not for a user to dump atmospherically on them message after message, and you've reached that point. If you have questions or concerns, or even curious or confused about something, leave as many messages as it takes until it's achieved. Whatever you're after, Google it or whatever search engine you want, but please stop volleying him about this. What is it that you want to know, maybe I can answer it, but please, lighten up on FTWinchester on this. Alright, I'm butting out now. -- ImperiexSeed, 11:10 PM, February 8th 2014

I don't mind it, really. She only messages me about once every three to five days. FTWinchester (talk) 13:27, February 10, 2014 (UTC)

I hope you read the latest comment that I wrote on the Devil's Trident talk page. I despisingly disagree that Castiel's Trench Coat and Dean's Amulet are merited on the same credentials. I can't understand, why does the Devil's Trident warrant page creation instead of just doing mentions of it around the wiki? -- ImperiexSeed, 2:43 PM, February 11th 2014

I'll start off by lightly getting into the conversation by directing you to Castiel's page under his personality. Even loopy Castiel still wore the trench coat, clearly notating just how important the coat really is to Castiel. It's unfair for you to try an compare the VARIOUS plaid over-shirts that the brothers wear to Castiel's trench coat, that only just recently, of eight seasons, was replaced with a different, but similar, trench coat. And also, I'm starting to get anger that people think the mentioning of a character should be included in their appearance list. I was scrolling down on Lucifer's page and his appearance section has been stacked with a ton of mentioned only's. What's your thoughts on this, man? Hey, are we still tight, or are you mad about the Devil's Trident thing?-- ImperiexSeed, 6:48 PM, February 11th 2014

Do you view me as your friend? I hope so cause, really, I look at you as a brother. I'd just like to know how you view me. Anyway, you seemed to have forgotten to give me your thoughts on whether mentioned only's should be crammed into a section on, for lack of a better word, what viewers know as some type of bodied manifestation. There's a difference between us seeing Crowley and having him simply mentioned, therefore they shouldn't be paired as it they're the same. Noting every single time Lucifer is mentioned, for example, in the appearance section is ill fitted. It is scrupulously unnecessary. -- ImperiexSeed, 9:18 PM, February 12th 2014

Depending on how technical you want to be. If you're brutally technical, then the mention of the character should, under any circumstance, not bear any type of mention under the appearance section. I'm not sure if I should go that far, given that there are, in fact, episodes where characters have not actually appeared but been strongly emphasized. In order for it to even seem, in any way, acceptable, the mentioning of the character has to be prudent and strong in the way that they're being mentioned. So, yes, in some cases, Eve would qualify, and so does Lucifer, along with Crowley, etc. -- ImperiexSeed, 9:38 PM, February 12th 2014

Do you mind trimming down any appearance section to only actual appearances, unless, like I said, they're prudent and strong? I'll help with it from time to time. -- ImperiexSeed, 7:06 PM, February 16th 2014

Sadly, it may be late in to undo all of them, I'm sorry to say. Really any main character, like Eve, Lucifer, Crowley, etc. But, like, on a character like Erica Cartwright's appearance section, there should only be episodes there that she appeared in. That's how I part between the two. I'd say suggestively that you slap messages down on the regular editors' talk pages, like General and RaghavD, and see what they think. -- ImperiexSeed, 11:26 PM, February 17th 2014

As I told you in my last message, I think we're so far in, that it's not possible to sufficiently achieve this unless we employ a group of users and bots. Can't say that's true, unfortunately, with how users edit these days. No matter who the character, if they're not prudently and strongly mentioned, they bear no place in the appearance section at all. -- ImperiexSeed, 5:18 PM, February 17th 2014

What, if any, of the books pertaining to the show should be considered canon?[]

I'll leave this alone if you want, but I'd appreciate it if you tried to cue me in on this, for it would dramatically change many things on this wiki. Did you or NailflidG determine whether any of the books should be considered canon? And methodologically how did you determine that? I'll stick with what I said, where for any of any of the books content to be considered, it can't just be relatively in conjunction with the show. One's preferences or wishes should never be a factor, in any way, to how you're going to accept something. And even a minor "oopsie" in them would make that content unreliable and not canon. Even though I don't own any of the books or read a word in any of them, one could say, yes, I cherry-picked where it positions Gabriel as younger than Raphael, something that was curiously brimmed over. I'm furiously agitated that they left this be. Now, even though I'd have a terrible time doing it, if it turns out that there's a contradiction in that book, then the whole thing must be deemed untrustworthy. Now I understand that the writers can't cover everything they want to in one episode, but some of the things in the books should've been aggravated in the show. Sorry if you did, in fact, cover what I've asked, but this issue must be put to rest. -- ImperiexSeed, 9:43 PM, February 19th 2014

In your opinion, is Jesus the creator or a man?[]

Oh man, this'll most likely spread out pretty fast and you're the first person I've told over wikia, but I'm no longer a Christian--I believe there's no evidence for the existence of any divine hand in any form. I hold a lack of belief based on no evidence. One of my reasons for this change, is how can a God who's all-loving, with omnipotence, sit idly by while rape is going on, or amputees who've done more good than the supposed good Jesus? Both sin and "higher purposes" are unacceptable, no sadistic, reasons for not intervening. I hope this don't infringe upon our friendship. I know there's been nothing to suggest anything about Jesus other than that he was a man in the show, but what do you think Jesus was? A spokesman, some sort of ethereal ambassador that was the only direct creation of God (as either the Psalms or Proverbs indicate), or a representative of God? I dismiss any notion that Jesus was a 'selected' vessel God used; his body comprised everything of God in that form, but God wasn't possessing some man named Jesus. -- ImperiexSeed, 7:25 PM, February 20th 2014

It seems like this is going to radically affect our friendship. A shame, really. But.. Um, yeah, I'm talking about the Jesus in the show. Sorry me thinking for myself actually ended a good relationship, now what, mate? -- ImperiexSeed, 7:42 PM, February 20th 2014
I wouldn't ever pronounce or declare there is or isn't a 'divine guiding hand' to the universe, but I do not occlude the magnificence of the universe as evidence that there is. So, then, this loving God essentially watches?! Either he's omnipotent and watches or he's not omnipotent and can't do anything about it. I agree with all of what you said strictly regarding how we should act towards others, but I don't need a god to be caring and understanding. You forgot to give me your thoughts on what you think Jesus is in the show. -- ImperiexSeed, 10:08 PM, February 20th 2014
What Jesus is (man and or God) was left vague by the show. Seeing as he's not intervened but only on God's orders, where is Jesus and what is the height of his power? If Jesus is God's representative, he could annihilate everything to a crisp, which he actually wanted to do at one point in the Bible. -- ImperiexSeed, 5:51 PM, February 21st 2014
Ricks say Jesus's was a man but also the Son of God, to which Eve didn't agree or disagree. It could be very plausible that God has many 'Sons,' born of virgins, that he uses to convey messages to humanity, which he could use these Sons to purge his creation to purify and start again when it gets really bad. Maybe God authors multiple stories and redoes his creation over and over again until finally, it's the End and similarly to the cross, God dies and stays dead. This is a theory, but a very usable one. What do you think, and please actually answer; not just a small sentence. -- ImperiexSeed, 3:29 PM, February 22nd 2014
Fine, but what do you think of my theory? Just as credible, I think, as the theory of God coming from a species called Chuckians, possessing omnipotence, omniscience, and omnipresence. What they call 'Sons'--them being incarnated through virgins--are versions of themselves in our world as we perceive it. What does FTWinchester think about all this? C'mon, give me some perception or comments on this. -- ImperiexSeed, 7:50 PM, February 22nd 2014
I didn't even name it that, some other user did. But wow, that was very darkly aggressive: you're the first-grader if you think I write like a first-grader. Look, you've now instigated me. I've treated you like a brother for a while now, and you call me a first-grader. It seems my deconverting of Christianity has rattled our friendship, which makes me glumly irritated. I thought we were becoming bros. Be honest, this has changed your view of me. -- ImperiexSeed, 8:24 PM, February 22nd 2014
None of them are nice. Buds? He did imprison them, but he'll only annihilate everything with his Sons and start fresh at the end of each story. -- ImperiexSeed, 9:16 PM, February 22nd 2014

Some things....[]

Did you watch "Captives?" I have a few things to go over with you.

Who/what was Naomi? In one of the episodes, Castiel said something to the effect of he knows the name of every angel, and was really addled that he didn't know her; was this just cause she messed with his mind? Was she a new type of angel, one of Atropos' big sises, or what?

I know they did something similar with Lucifer possessing Sam's body (which I'll get back to in a second), but the 'angel expelling' thing introduced in season nine is really gall, because it was never pliable till now. Bobby evicting the demon was a lot better than an angel expulsion. Now, it makes sense in that circumstance that Sam wouldn't have wanted to expel Lucifer from him cause he wanted to imprison him. Due to this angel expulsion being an out, it makes you wonder what all angels do to their vessels to bind them from regaining control.

About Castiel's ability to overcome really any angel in an angel blade fight intrigues me. Every angel who's engaged in an angel blade fight Castiel's beaten. How is he this good, and this is so severe I even entertain the thought of could he potentially be able to beat even an archangel only in the context of blade fighting. -- ImperiexSeed, 1:44 PM, February 27th 2014

So, did you watch the episode or did you just snag that off of Bartholomew's page? I never said Castiel can outdo archangels in angel blade tussling, but I entertained the idea because of how good he is. Are we still amigos? -- ImperiexSeed, 3:28 PM, February 27th 2014

What first comes to mind when you think of Death's cell? Spout off anything and criticize about it, just not about me. I don't think it was ever stated or implied that it's a coffin, what the quote actually said was something to the effect of, They keep him chained in a box six feet under. Which, to me, brims over many things. Chains? Well.. what type of chains? Man-made chains used for this purpose? And could this "box" actually hold other beings, like archangels, or is it lathered in spell-work specifically for Death? And it also raises a question for users who believe that Death is stronger: how did Death get put here? Did he go willingly or was he brutally overpowered and imprisoned? And, to cover all bases, it's crazy to think he was just bond by naturalistic means not to mention impossible-normal chains couldn't exist at the core of the Earth. Give me something to work with. -- ImperiexSeed, 9:05 PM, February 27th 2014

No, I asked this yesterday before the topic was started where it is on Death's talk page. -- ImperiexSeed, 3:23 PM, February 28th 2014

Hey, man, did you watch "Thinman?" I purely only enjoyed the interactions the brothers/Ghostfacers had with each other. I know it's not my place, but I'd really recommend you watch it even for just one cause. I think I'm getting what you mean when you say like 'the show's going to Hell,' because there was one scene particularly where the brothers used one piece of evidence for the case-teleportation. Sam made the comment, "When I first think of teleporation, I think of Crossroads demon." I understand characters can have their own look at something but really, out of angels, Leprechauns, reapers, "gods," and Shojo, you think of that? Ok.. Hey, how can I assist in the timeline thing? Would you like me to watch certain episodes and pull out certain dates, or what? -- ImperiexSeed, 10:26 PM, March 4th 2014

I'm having archangel fetishes I can't contain, even despite the story discretion that almost always follows (unless your Kripke!). Gosh, they really do need to at least splash or even dip into other waters of the lore. That'd really help the story, especially seeing as we're probably gonna get a tenth season. As I said on the Chronology of Supernatural talk page, I know I'm not going to be good at this. Plus, I don't even know where to start. If you ever need something looked into, come and notify me and I'll do it. I can't picture myself in any manner researching and sitting through episodes that might not have any dates that we need. So, yeah, contact me if you need anything. -- ImperiexSeed, 10:58 PM, March 4th 2014

Re: Timeline[]

Sorry it took me so long to respond. I've been checking in on the wikia frequently, but haven't had the time to actually contribute anything, thanks to a hellacious amount of work. Anyway, I'll try to reply to your post on the Talk: Chronology page ASAP.--NaiflidG (talk) 21:33, March 4, 2014 (UTC)

You mean for the timeline project we were working on? Yeah, here on the Talk page for Chronology of Supernatural. I might have more information / speculation on dates that I haven't posted yet (I tend to save potential edits to a file and work them over for awhile before actually editing anything), but I haven't checked recently. I'll get back to you on that tomorrow or the next day, depending on how much free time I have -- am currently a little bogged down with work and my family is celebrating Thanksgiving this Sunday. Anyway, congratulations on being promoted to admin! I think you'll do an excellent job for however long you want to keep it. That said -- seeing as how you weren't exactly champing at the bit to get the position -- if you ever want to step down, for whatever reason, none of us would think any less of you, even if it were as soon as another user was made admin. Just do what makes you happy, okay? Okay, take care, bud.--NaiflidG (talk) 07:12, November 22, 2014 (UTC)

Can monsters and non-human creatures become ghosts?[]

Can monsters and non-human creatures become ghosts? I only ask this cause somewhere on this wiki, it says that reapers escort beings to Purgatory as well, so like humans, what if they refuse to go with the reaper? Or are reapers never involved in escorting monsters over and they go there instantly after death? It's pretty much just been assumed, as far as I can tell, that reapers escort every deceased being to whatever afterlife fits the type of being, even though only Heaven and Hell have been confirmed. Oh man, ghost monsters would pose a huge problem. Also, wouldn't you say that Ian and Paul were possessed by Sandover when they killed themselves, or were they just influenced by him? If they were possessed, they need to have the vessels category on their pages, which I'll take care of. -- ImperiexSeed, 1:33 PM, March 5th 2014

No, Ian and Paul where characters in "It's A Terrible Life." They offed themselves, because Sandover possessed them and made them or influenced them to. Seeing as both occur pretty quick in, mind watching for them and tell me what you think? -- ImperiexSeed, 9:39 PM, March 5th 2014

Gotten around to "Thinman" yet? Don't mean to bug or nag. The character interactions aside, it was a terrible episode. Ok, then why aren't every deceased monster still on Earth to continue to amok, I mean try an imagine the power variance a monster ghost could amount? My goodness, wow! So, anyway, why would a monster choose Purgatory over becoming a monster ghost? -- ImperiexSeed, 12:32 PM, March 6th 2014

I'm almost finished essentially frickin' recreating the Horsemen page, but I need your thoughts on something-when the Horsemen (but, not Death) are pealed from their rings, do their spirits stay stuck in their incapacitated bodies or do they leave behind their constructs on the Earthly, visible plain till the day that Death destroys everything? They probably amount countless bodies left over from age to age that Death will have to mop up. -- ImperiexSeed, 6:35 PM, March 8th 2014

I know it's hard to conceptualize the idea of Death predating/outlasting death, but such is the case in supernatural. And unlike any of the other Horsemen, Death, the being, and death aren't correlative where that death must exist for Death to. I know you don't want to tip your thinking-cap, but the show has made it so that Death will exist forever, regardless if it makes sense or not-just like them creating a hole where the Judeo/Abrahamic God can be killed. Eventually, you have to accept that they're ok with making no sense. It's a lot easier after accepting this. -- ImperiexSeed, 11:54 PM, March 9th 2014

Seconding that, I'm almost to the point of being infuriated of having to do everything myself concerning plot/story of an episode, character, weakness, etc. Eric did marvelously at being able to leave tiny crumbs that the watchers could piece together without ruining the episode right off the bat. -- ImperiexSeed, 11:53 PM, March 10th 2014

Horrifyingly BIG![]

I think I can trash the asinine theory that only four angels have seen God. Anna hoisting such a bold, absolute statement had to have been a rumor. This had to have been an dissemination of some batty angel that she bought into-she must've been as crazy as our temporarily insane seraph, Castiel. ha ha Metatron met God, by "sitting his feet." Also, they've all at least heard God's voice when he demanded that they all 'kiss humanity's ass,' so I don't know how Uriel could say that there's no God. The only approach that would make sense is if a variety of four met him, which doesn't hold, being inconsistent with canon when it's clear that the archangels are the four Anna referred to. -- ImperiexSeed, 11:21 PM, March 14th 2014

Something new now![]

What the Purgatory has become of this series?! LOL I wish I could know. Where do you want the series to go, if there's anywhere upwards to go? Their originality has largely slumped or sprinkled down by the 'only this can kill it' thing, with Leviathan and the Knights of Hell. You can still make a season interesting with creatures that can be killed/harmed by multiple means, even with the most basic enemies like werewolves. That exactly summarizes the goal of both entire seasons 7 and 9-find/create this one weapon that can kill it. That has become a very bald, lame shortcut for the writers to not have to think about anything. Wouldn't want to strain them too hard, would we? I think, for the survival of the series, they should dial way down on the antagonist side. Do an easy enemy with a big plan. Simplify the heck out of it and maybe it'll go somewhere, wherever there is to go. This would mean no archangels, top-level demons, essentially no angels, just Dean and Sam vs maybe a monster with a end game so big, it stretches to a season eleven or if they're not doing one, till the end of the tenth season. Now chucking angels out of the story would be really hard, mine as well (with "Blade Runners" since anything after season five) make up some farcical spell to get rid of them. This 'angel/heaven vs 'demon/Hell' thing is now stale and distasteful. Or maybe a cherub could be the main villain looking for Joseph's coat of many colors that can manipulate emotions to the point of potential revitalization of War, who and Dean, Sam and their "god," Artemis, confront him in the final battle of the series. I haven't even curbed with any of this. Maybe a psychotic reaper had escorted John Winchester to Purgatory this whole time and only his wedding ring, which Christ himself enchanted, can be what binds War and everything oppositional (Azazel, Lucifer, Leviathan, etc) since Gadreel's mistake to the judgement of God. Where maybe the resurrection of Zachariah's incinerated vessel (by Michael) is a component to a spell serving as a key to something Dean and Sam need, pedaling forward into the end of the series. And Dean and Sam drive off over asphalt with their father saying "Well done, boys" as the credits come on. They should listen to me, shouldn't they? Thoughts? -- ImperiexSeed, 1:16 PM, April 2nd 2014

You're kidding right? He's kidding, right? That wouldn't work! Not at all! Of course we need bigger villains! Except how about something that has no way to die? Like maybe a Pagan unlike any of those seen before. Daedric Prince of Awesomeness (talk) 22:04, April 3, 2014 (UTC)

I'm trying to talk to FTWinchester. You're perceptively lost if you think I'm kidding, Jyggalag Daedric Prince of Order. I don't want to call you a name but I will if you're this stupid again. A pagan deity as the main villain would only further the rut we're now in because of season seven and nine. -- ImperiexSeed, 6:12 PM, April 3rd 2014

You don't remember me do you? It's me, Kesslerbeast. Anywho.... It wouldn't further the rut because there is no rut. And I knew you were kidding. But being ImperiexSeed, you failed to realise I WAS kidding. I actually think it's a very good idea for a regular joe-blow monster to be the Big Bad. It's good to be back. Daedric Prince of Awesomeness (talk) 22:20, April 3, 2014 (UTC)

I agree with you that the show has gone stale. I watched the latest episode (was it the latest with the nuns, yes?--I don't even know) and while it was okay, it does not feel like Supernatural anymore. Sure, there are still demons, and we finally heard the exorcism again, but something still felt off. I am a bit confused with what you suggested, since this season is basically using low-key antagonists whose "end games" stretch on forever. Sure, Abaddon is a Knight of Hell, but they seem keen to tone down her strength so Dean and Crowley fighting her would seem credible. Metatron is really bland and tasteless and a mere scribe, and he is the main villain (I won't call them Big Bad--they don't deserve it, not really) whose lame plans stretch forever. Plus, don't take this in a bad way but you disliked the "find weapon to kill x" yet your suggestion includes a weapon that could control war? I'm really confused.

I don't even know what the show could use right now. They threw away so many characters and arcs with strong and fresh potential, and we are way past going back to them now. Carver got his wish of moving away from really old and powerful Big Bads, and he got his wish of stretching this damn uniniteresting, flat, repetitive and low-stakes arc all the way to his season 10. I find it hard to believe this show still won't die like its main characters, and I really find it impossible that it's gaining more viewers. If it does, I think these viewers are fresh blood, and those who supported the show from the early eras have left or are leaving.

In all honesty, it pains me that the show I would have defended to death is now a show I dislike (borderline utterly despise). It's nothing but fangirl pandering and supposed "character development" but nothing really is new anymore. Its plot makes absolute zero sense. Why is Dean suddenly going after Abaddon when it was Metatron who screwed them up actively several times over in more personal levels the first half of season 9 even more than Abaddon did? And why don't they just do away with both Crowley and Abaddon? I'm sick of Crowley's character. Even Dean, whom I held in high respect and whom I even used as a model in some aspects, completely irks me. The actors and actresses really do their job well but it's really the script and the story that sells the show to me, so to avoid hating on the show, I just try to avoid it whenever I can. I think I've made my points on why I don't like the show anymore so I really don't want to spread more negative vibes by listing each and everything I find wrong/annoying/stupid for this season. Oh and I wish them good luck on the spin-off. Kripke would be there so I am assuming he's stepping in to at least steer the spin-off to the right direction and somehow salvage his universe, but given all the crap that happened, he probably needs to sell his soul to actually pull it off. At this point, I prefer even the boring Season 7--at least it had a good direction and was cohesive, instead of mashing up all sorts of subplots that suddenly change directions without reason or rhyme (when was the last time they mentioned the words of God?). FTWinchester (talk) 03:32, April 5, 2014 (UTC)

Don't exactly recall when they were solely mentioned, however Words of God did appear in "Road Trip." The mere prospect of the Words of God in the series, like many others, is an out where they don't have to do much thinking: "Okami? Oh, the Word of God can take care of them. Ruguru? Once again, the Word of God can take care of them." By doing this, the writers don't have to actually think of a sensible and coherent weakness, they just throw the Word of God in place as a "cure-all." While aggravatingly ticked by what's become of Kripke's brilliance, I'll watch it to it's end regardless. While really good for season four and five, I sweetly say that this 'angel/heaven vs demon/Hell' shouldn't be put on a minimization, but be stowed away for pretty much the remainder of the series' span, seeing as we're most definitely ending with season ten. Be done with it considerably-no demons of any level, no angel (but maybe cupid) and make Castiel swing by rarely, here and there. Swivel something very low, like werewolf or even a Leprechaun, with an effective plan but, if a werewolf, be easily defeated once climatically found. Thoughts? -- ImperiexSeed, 2:01 PM, April 14th 2014

Though truly botched, I'll watch this series through it's end. Ok, who the Hell is God in the series? Chuck, Crowley or Metatron? I ask that rhetorically. I wanna gonk Carver over the head with Kripke's masterfully written script. ha ha I do see a bulging parallel between Eric Kripke, his avatar, and Carver's, Metatron. And to answer your question, he's no where near fuc**** entitled to attempt an lord over things like that. Granted, avatars could just be a way for the current writer of expressing himself or herself in the show, though only one true God can exist. Chuck could've easily really been God, because there wasn't much to him anyway that would dampen any possibility of him being God. I bill Chuck as the God of the series. Whereas Metatron is clearly an angel who's merely writing as though he is author, of something he's byproduct of. ha ha And just let me say, for kicks, that, though exponentially way more powerful with the demon and angel tablets, it's quite clear he's at least not omniscient-and, therefore, NOT God. -- ImperiexSeed, 6:54 PM, April 24th 2014


No problem! Sorry to hear about your interest dying. Mine has been dying as well, this season doesn't look as good as the others, sort of on the bottom of my list of shows to watch at the moment. If you ever need series recommendations, I'm here to talk :P

I've added you, here's my FC: Sam, 4356-0526-8626! Thank you! Gurgatory (talk) 01:33, April 9, 2014 (UTC)

LMAO! I just got memed on. You just memed me.

I've been trying to get into GOT, I've heard good things, but I don't have HBO so I'll just have to either watch it online or buy the DVDs. Not sure about the other shows, I'll probably get into them as well later on. I finished the first season of Korra and haven't gotten around to the other seasons, I dunno, the ending was cheesy and I was annoyed how they all got their powers back.

Supernatural is one of my favorite TV shows (I'm sure this might be the same for you), so trust me on this one, I suggest Attack on Titan. Not sure if you're already into it due to Tumblr, but if you want that same Supernatural feel but worse (or better?), I suggest this. It's...something else. If you enjoy creepy villains, tear-wrenching love and bravery (offered similarly to us by Sam and Dean), groundbreaking action scenes, and overall awesomeness, I'd suggest it. If you do intend to watch it, go to Crunchyroll, the subtitles are the best available.

Gurgatory (talk) 22:41, April 9, 2014 (UTC)

Lol I never said they were bad! It's just that, I don't know, I never really took interest in Angel because it seemed more aimed towards girls (did you see Jensen's moves?) but I was planning on watching it later. Just give this a try, a Supernatural(ian? ist?) approves. *brofist* Gurgatory (talk) 22:41, April 9, 2014 (UTC)

Oh my god. I am so sorry. It glitched or something and I literally didn't see anything that you put before the Angel part, or something... Crap... Let me read over it again Gurgatory (talk) 02:29, April 10, 2014 (UTC)

Okay, here goes now - SORRY, I NEVER meant Angel, I meant to say Dark Angel. That's a show Jensen was in, and I'm sorry, but I can't take anything he's been in before SPN seriously. I think it got cancelled early as well. I'll definitely check out Korra now, that's good news. I like to hear that a fan knows the first season sucked, that means it gets better haha.

I've always been quite distrustful of shows at first, and I don't really take that guy (David) seriously after Bones, but I'll give it a chance. I don't think it could be better than Supernatural, this is Supernatural we're talking about.

AS FOR POKEMON :D - I haven't had time to play lately, but my team is so huge I can't even count ... most of them aren't IV trained so I keep them to keep them. My faves though are Grumpig, Reuniclus, Whimsicott, and a few others - I'm quite the Gen 4, Gen 5 fanboy. (Embarrassingly) I've actually forgotten my main team :S This is weird. What are your faves?

That's all I got! Gurgatory (talk) 02:41, April 10, 2014 (UTC)

Oh I see.. Can Buffy match the badass villains, the creepiness, the tear-jerking bond between the brothers, and more? I've been looking for new shows to watch and this is on Netflix so I'm pretty excited to check this out actually. Thanks for the recommendation!

I like those, minus the starters - I don't know why, I've never liked starters... UGH, Greninja with Protean is so annoying when I'm playing online. Gurgatory (talk) 02:59, April 10, 2014 (UTC)

Dang, that does sound interesting... The way you put it, with the equivalency and all, makes me even more curious. Those villains sound really good too. I'll probably hit Netflix on the weekend! I've heard the first season is slow but I'll pull through, like we all did with Supernatural haha.

I guess I just disliked them because I looked at them as legendaries - invalid and overpowered. Just recently I realized that probably isn't true.

It was good talking to you, I've got to hit the hay! Peace! Gurgatory (talk) 03:24, April 10, 2014 (UTC)

Whoa.. I didn't know that!!

COUGHS LOUDLY There are faithful manga readers that will tell you to read it first because they changed lots of things in the latest episodes, but I say skip to the anime first. Definitely. Well, goodnight! Stay awesome as well Gurgatory (talk) 03:34, April 10, 2014 (UTC)

Oh that's good. I've seen flashes on clips, and I always assumed that they made her a weak protagonist, and I'm glad that's different haha. Man, that quote makes it sound like Supernatural is but a slight rip-off. I can't wait to watch the show on Netflix now.

I remember James Marsters was in both Buffy and SPN, and they did some sort of reunion, I forgot. That's funny. I'm glad Singer is still on the show.

Quite different, but the anime is much better. Not only is the art not amazing in the first few volumes (even the manga readers admit this), but the anime transforms this series into something that, if you have never seen anything like it, you'll be pleasantly horrified. They just bring it to life, is what I'm trying to say. Gurgatory (talk) 16:06, April 10, 2014 (UTC)

That's so true, I've heard lots of fans say Supernatural was at least partly influenced by Buffy.

That's good! Just make sure you don't trip over spoilers... They are so easy to find... Also, at all costs, if you're doing anything related to the show on Youtube, avoid the comments, there are manga supremacists who spoiler for fun. They're basically the genwunners of the show. Gurgatory (talk) 19:08, April 11, 2014 (UTC)

Ayeee thanks!! Yeah, it's a shame, but I don't blame them. You guys have helped transform this wikia into something so amazing and huge, but the show plot-wise is going downhill and lots of loyal fans aren't going out of their way to watch it anymore. D: Gurgatory (talk) 07:28, April 20, 2014 (UTC)

Sorry missed that, will do :) Gurgatory (talk) 04:54, April 24, 2014 (UTC)

Hey!! Congrats on adminship. I've always wondered why you never were one, as you have a superb sense of judgment and majestic editing-skills. Can't wait to see you help the wiki for the better.

Anyway, yeah, I don't get Omega Ruby until Friday. ;n; And I live in the US, too. It's because Target shipping is much slower than what I projected. I just wanted to pre-order early (August) but now I regret that. I should have bought it in the store days ago if I had kept my money. Oh well. How about you? Gourgeist (talk) 17:13, November 25, 2014 (UTC)

Oh no, I'm not lying. Unbias, to the point well-intended editing. The Citations principal is the best community-based decision I've ever seen on the wiki. So much counterproductive edits (often even originating from previous admins) that end up having articles look like an unfinished sandwich, lol. Just opinion but, I've really not liked the way things have been around here, it's all subjective child's play and no real will or want to actually benefit the encyclopedia this wiki intends to be. For example, ignoring the need for citations and instead focusing on which character did what when. Sorry, I'm sounding mean-spirited, but I hope you understand. My point is though, that I've always noticed you actually want it to expand positively.

That's sad. There's always online and internet communities (Tumblr, Reddit, etc for example and even in-game online) eager to play the game with you. From what I've seen it's a great game. Still waiting for it to hopefully arrive tomorrow because if it doesn't, Thanksgiving will push it even further away from me.

Yep, haven't finished it though! Watching Walking Dead as well (though I prefer Buffy of course), but it's quite the weird show. Both are HAHA. But I love Buffy a lot, you wouldn't expect the characters to grow on you but they really do. I should thank you for introducing me as well. Gourgeist (talk) 06:05, November 26, 2014 (UTC)

So sorry for the late reply, Thanksgiving has been really busy today. I agree, those were good times. And I admire that dying fire analogy for some reason xD But to the point, I very much hope it does as well! ^___^ You can expect me to be using it for now on, though hopefully I won't forget.

It is a tough call! Whichever villainous team you prefer, I suppose.

DEFINITELY. I should have watched this first before Supernatural, not that one is necessarily better than the other, but it feels like I'm watching history (like Neon Genesis Evangelion to the anime industry -- first of its own). Regardless, enjoy your holidays ^__^ Gourgeist (talk) 20:41, November 27, 2014 (UTC)

Yep, and of course, Maggie and Don Stark lol Gourgeist (talk) 19:01, November 29, 2014 (UTC)

I THOUGHT SOMETHING LIKE THAT TOO LOL. Sorta satisfied with what we got, though, because I never expected fanservice in the first place. Gourgeist (talk) 16:34, December 1, 2014 (UTC)

Agree. And always happy to help. Gourgeist (talk) 03:27, December 2, 2014 (UTC)

Hey, could you delete the Duane Tanner redirect? It conflicts with me trying to rename Dwayne Tanner to Duane Tanner (as he is credited on IMDB). Much thanks. Gourgeist (talk) 06:48, December 6, 2014 (UTC)

Anon vandals[]

Blocked both users for a week. -- ImperiexSeed, 6:44 PM, April 9th 2014

What the....[]

How was Castiel able to grow a beard? I thought such things for an occupied vessel (peeing, pooping, coughing, burping, sneezing, farting, etc) is quashed, or disallowed. Do archangels face any type of damage after a Fall? Lucifer didn't convey to be at all lower in strength because of the Fall. Lucifer (obviously not counting God or Death) was unsurpassable, even in a Plan B vessel, until late in the last episode where he confronted Michael. So if that was Lucifer weakened from the Fall, of my fuc**** goodness, I can't imagine what he'd look like at full power. However, the illusion of Gabriel that Metatron used in "Meta Fiction" implied that Falling does dimple their powers to an unspecified degree. Do you think Jesse could've opened the cage by telling it to open if he wanted? And although Ruby's knife can hurt him, I mean, he could accomplish virtually any feat just by speaking. And, Jesse says, "Let there not be light" and the whole Earth goes dark. ha ha Anyway, how you doing man? We still bros, I hope. -- ImperiexSeed, 7:30 PM, April 28th 2014

In the trailer of the upcoming episode, it's said by Dean that the First Blade can kill anything. Really! Since when can this blade kill fuc**** everything? They're definitely remaking this series and it's really starting to bug me. I mean, the writers could use what Kripke already established angels blades and use one on Metatron instead of splurging the show with inconsistencies. Anyway, how you doing? Are we still bros? -- ImperiexSeed, 11:05 PM, May 10th 2014

See you on chat for a little bit? -- ImperiexSeed, 9:35 PM, May 14th 2014

Why did you leave me on chat without at least just saying a simple "have to go" or something? It's not Carver doesn't know how to write it's there comes a point with anything in the field of writing when there's nothing left to write about that would promote it any further, without tarnishing it. Eventually a point is reached where there's nothing left to write about, no matter how clever or good of a writer you are. Keeping it going to another season worked for a little bit but we, the fans, have tumbled off a precipice with where this series has gone. Whether Carver is obliviously or willfully unhinging Kripke's work for his own is up for debate. It was a mistake to continuate the series after "Swan Song" but they did and so they have to see it through. You can even see it with angel blades where they don't kill a couple species the same way, but pretty much everything. And, so, they can't think of unique methods of killing, for example, reapers and actually make it interesting they just slap on angel blade as a weakness and, to make it worse, they look the same as angels while dying. It was sorta a smidgen cool how the bone weapon was the only conventional method of killing Leviathan, but now, we have that, the archangel blade, and the First Blade. Making it terribly bland. What are your true feelings on this topic? -- ImperiexSeed, 11:51 PM, May 14th 2014

It was faintly and dimly suggested at in season six that there was another possible way, besides the Horsemen rings, to open Lucifer's cage, what do you think it was? I acknowledge that retecon is a burly problem, which is the answer to a lot of the "what-the's" in the show mostly, but let's try an do some thinking here. Also, Dean gave the heavy impression that no weapon of any make could kill Castiel while he housed all of Purgatory's souls, however Death's little doodad could easily kill him. Did he not even think of it as an option because, being in Death's possession, it would be impossible to even an attempt to get it from him? Sorry it took my a while, but I've come to the realization a little while ago that seasons 1-5 is THE story Supernatural. It's absolutely masterful. I irresolute and find it tricky to assess anything after "Swan Song" to cohere with Kripke's work, especially the pile of shi* Carver made with season nine. Soooooooooooo many overlaps and contradictions. I still watch the show, though irksomely. What do you miss most of the good ol' days (Kripke's seasons)? -- ImperiexSeed, 8:44 PM, May 24th 2014

Is what Dean said to Tess really indisputable? I mean, he could've been talking about her looks or something. I know Carver's blighted the essence of Supernatural, but I don't think even Carver would contradict that badly by calling a whole species something else, cause it'd be like calling archangels frogs. Reapers are not angels created by God, they were created by Death to help him maintain the Natural Order. Where art tho, Supernatural? What has become of thee? Baby come back, you can blame it all on Carver. hehe >:) -- ImperiexSeed, 6:04 PM, May 30th 2014

Alright, get back to me when you watch the episode. No, Death was called "the angel of death." But he really should've clarified if that's what he meant. And how would Azazel die if he possessed Tessa if she was an angel? Why, because the angel's energy would obliterate it? If that's what you're getting at, you're demonstrably wrong, as demons can possess vessels angels are using with absolutely no harm to themselves, as shown with Crowley in "Road Trip." No I really don't think Carver would contradict that bad. Hey, where do you think they're going to go with season ten? -- ImperiexSeed, 7:38 PM, May 31st 2014

Mind doing me a favor and comment on whether or not Heaven's dungeon should be a page on its talk page? "Dean.wincherstor.54," the user who created it, would really like your opinion on it. Thanks, man. -- ImperiexSeed, 1:17 AM, June 3rd 2014

Tonight's episode[]

So I decided to keep watching Doctor Who with my brother instead of watching tonight's episode. What happened? Anything good happen? Or the usual Carver bull?--NaiflidG (talk) 02:07, May 14, 2014 (UTC)

Nah, it's cool. I'll go look up some episode summaries and maybe catch it if they air it as a rerun during the summer hiatus. To be honest, last week's episode--the way they killed Abaddon off with so little build-up, in such a stupid way, when she was really one of the last things left on the show that was still cool--that was kind of the last straw for me. Early Supernatural is still my favorite show, but it's been infuriating for me to keep watching the show turn so bad under these lazy hack-writers. I'm still sticking around for the end, whenever it comes, and I'll still be around on this wikia to hopefully complete some of my projects, but... Yeah. Show sucks ass now. It's better to start getting into new things to hold your interest. Are you planning to watch NBC's TV adaptation of Constantine, by the way? The trailer for it looks pretty cool.--NaiflidG (talk) 05:20, May 14, 2014 (UTC)


God>Death>Michael>Lucifer>Castiel w/ all of Purgatory's souls>Gabriel>Raphael>Leviathan>Jesse Turner>Eve>Zachariah (seraphs)>Lilith>Cain>Azazel>Uriel>Virgil>Alastair>Reapers>Ghosts>monsters. Do you agree with this scale? -- ImperiexSeed, 1:24 AM, May 22nd 2014

You're very welcome, man. How you been? -- ImperiexSeed, 10:28 PM, June 9th 2014

Are you sure we're cool? You don't seem to talk to me as much anymore, or, if you do, you just send one line. -- ImperiexSeed, 10:41 PM, June 9th 2014

You're probably right, it's not as linear as that when taking into account all those things you mentioned. -- ImperiexSeed, 2:45 PM, June 10th 2014

Hey FTWinchester, how have you been doing? If you don't mind, could you put your opinion on my Strength Scale blog? Thanks a bunch! :) EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 18:09, August 11, 2014 (UTC)

Thanks for putting your opinion on my strength scale blog. I found your picture interesting, and love the different dynamics to it. As there are many different dynamics to power, you can't exactly make a list. However, what I meant is more like, "make a list of who would beat who". Like since Leviathan beat Archangels, it would be "Leviathan>archangel". Please put that kind of list on my blog, if you have the time. Thanks EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 00:37, September 2, 2014 (UTC)

Castiel could've raised Death used him during the events of season five to stop and kill Lucifer[]

Why didn't Castiel just preform the ritual Lucifer did on the grounds of an environment that strained serious carnage and use him to stop and kill Lucifer. Nothing on that list wouldn't made him hesitate, as he really doesn't seem to mind killing vessels that are possessed by demons ("Heaven and Hell," The Rapture," "Abandon All Hope...," "The Man Who Would Be King" and "The Man Who Knew Too Much," etc) well at least wouldn't have before season nine and "First Born." So he could've apported the specific vessels and requirements needed for the ritual and sacrifice them, cause he's shown in the episodes I listed that he doesn't hesitate to kill demons because they're in a vessel. Maybe he didn't think of that initially because he'd pick his father, who at the time thought of him as holy and just, before he'd even think of turning to Death. And when he lost faith and trust in God in "Dark Side of the Moon," Lucifer had already raised and bound Death. Hope to hear from you soon, buddy. -- ImperiexSeed, 10:25 PM, July 6th 2014

There you go, buddy, I soundly explained why his title is inappropriate. -- ImperiexSeed, 5:28 PM, July 21st 2014

Actually, after a long debate with him, I'm sorry, nothing against you, buddy, but he's right. The ritual is used to restore a person's body and there's nothing to suggest that it'll only work with demonic vessels (or anything at all, for that matter, other than it restores human bodies), so it should be likewise titled 'Human Body Restoration ritual.' -- ImperiexSeed, 7:03 PM, July 21st 2014
True, in the show, a pretty good amount of rituals are severely goal-centered, but it seems reasonable to call it by 'Human body restoration ritual' as that's what it is. And there's really nothing to axiomatically indicate that it can only solely work on a demon's vessel purely, as even then, by default, the title would still fit as it's a human body, i.e. 'Human body restoration ritual' is appropriate and accurate and doesn't at all misdirect nor misinformatively shade the topic of the page. -- ImperiexSeed, 5:22 PM, July 23rd 2014

Re: Edit War[]

What'd I miss? Has the issue been sorted? If not, then here's my 2 cents. The ritual was for restoring the demon's host. We'll never know whether a normal human body that has been charred beyond recognition could be restored by the ritual. So the better thing to do would be to stick to what has been shown on the show. RaghavD'"Look into my eyes. It’s where my demons hide" 16:36, July 24, 2014 (UTC)

Re:On Retcon of Reapers[]

Really now...what was the retconning? I haven't watched anything from the latest season except the season finale so you will have to bring me up to speed, I'm afraid haha. Calebchiam Talk 13:26, September 27, 2014 (UTC)

Hey, FTWinchester, been a long time hope all is well with you. I was just wondering to get your opinion on the reapers are angels subject. I see you've left templates on pages about it being retconned. I for one think this is a smart as I've always 100% agreed with many around here that this is simply not the case, the line could have Jensen adlibbing or Dean just using slang as he often does. There is simply no way to know for sure for sure off of just one line, I just don't and can't believe Carver would go back and retcon something like that. If you check the internet you'll see this has been a subject of debate for many supernatural fan websites. However the wikis are about compromise and I believe leaving the template is pretty smart as it lets the viewer to decide what to believe for themselves, the more I've talked to users around here the more most agree with me with one or two sticking to their belief of reapers being angels now. My question for you is do you believe the reaper page itself, also needs a template? I believe I saw it there before, but I not sure now, I'm curious if you deleted it and if there was a reason so? Also I see that you're a buffy fan? haha I own the entire series including Angel seen every epi of both at LEAST 10 times. Awesome. BKshadows (talk)

Thanks a lot for your help on that and I agree it makes no sense what so ever but I guess there is little we can do. The writers have actually stated they use the Supernatural Superwiki to consult all things lore when writing an episode, it sure doesn't seem like that these days. Ahh Angel Season 4 was quite a ride wasn't it? While I enjoyed season 5 I'm sorry the show wasn't able to continue on, as you'll see toward the end a lot of things were wrapped up rather quickly in the last 6 episodes, as the cancelation was announced. Are you going to read the comics once your done? I'm sorry to say I haven't been able to keep up but I do know their in Season 10 of Buffy now. It's just a lot of reading! and unfortunately id rather see Sarah Michelle Gellar and the rest on our screens acting things out instead of just reading from the comicbook. BKshadows (talk)


Just thought I'd come by and say hello. I'm in the middle of season two of Buffy and loving it. ^_____^ Gourgeist (talk) 04:03, October 31, 2014 (UTC)

Thanks, I do look forward to it! I've heard a whole lot about Angel, too. And don't feel bad, I'm afraid you might not like it anyway (anything can happen), so I like to maintain the thought of possibility. Oh, and I need to start Korra, lol. Happy Halloween and please stay awesome as well! :) Gourgeist (talk) 05:05, October 31, 2014 (UTC)


Hey FTWinchester, just familiarise yourself with these (though incomplete for now) and Supernatural Wiki:Administrators. Once you've read and understood everything, leave a message on my talk page and I'll sysop you. Feel free to seek clarification if anything is unclear. There is no official probationary period, so don't be afraid to make mistakes. Exercise your judgment to the best of your ability and ask the other admins if you need help with anything.

Do note however, that unlike in other online communities, being an admin is not the same as being a leader of the community. Your word is not the final say on the matter (just as mine isn't) and if the community disagrees with you - your opinion is no more valid than theirs. This is of course unless the dispute can be resolved based on fundamental Wiki principles that are obvious to everyone, to which no one will blame you if you say stop carrying on the discussion with someone who says that all IP addresses should be blocked from editing the Wiki. But in the case of say the alias/retcon templates or the granularity discussion we had on what deserves an article on the Wiki, your opinion holds equal weight as everyone else's. I cannot stress this enough - the admin's word is not final in such cases.

Of course, if you don't feel comfortable, you can remove the tools yourself. But I think you'll find it straightforward enough. (: Cheers. Calebchiam Talk 03:29, November 22, 2014 (UTC)

Yeah, I figured you meant in a general sense. Just making it clear since you're about to become an admin. Calebchiam Talk 03:46, November 22, 2014 (UTC)

Congratulations! You can now do the following:

  • Edit and move fully protected pages
  • Delete, restore, and view deleted revisions of pages and images
  • Protect pages from edits, moves, or creation by non-sysops
  • Block and unblock users and IP addresses and ranges
  • Edit the interface pages in the MediaWiki: namespace
  • View Special:Unwatchedpages

Use the tools well. Cheers, Calebchiam Talk 04:33, November 22, 2014 (UTC)

So glad that you're finally an admin. Congrats and welcome to the team, bro! :) RaghavD'"Look into my eyes. It’s where my demons hide" 12:03, November 22, 2014 (UTC)

Re: Thanks[]

Not a problem at all. Feel free to leave a message and I'll respond as fast as I can. Just click and explore things. For instance, try out the theme designer. You'll be intrigued, I'm sure. You can always revert back to the old theme. I've been meaning to revamp the Navigation Bar for a long time. Hopefully we can brainstorm on that. RaghavD'"Look into my eyes. It’s where my demons hide" 14:02, November 22, 2014 (UTC)


this anon keeps vandalizing God, and did the same with 66 Seals. Just warning you Gabriel456 (talk) 00:10, November 23, 2014 (UTC)


Hey. Both sound like great ideas. The Verb tense policy is effectively a style guide - it will some expansion before it is comprehensive enough, but feel free to create a page at Supernatural Wiki:Style_Guide (which would put it under the Wiki namespace rather than the article namespace) and have a go at it. I'll add on when I get the chance. You can use this as a reference - just ignore the portions that are specific to that Wiki topic. References come under the Style Guide as well, this should prove helpful. If you can get the pages up to scratch on the Wiki, we can certainly start using it as a guide. Cheers. Calebchiam Talk 01:51, November 23, 2014 (UTC)

Don't worry about it, I would have been just as exasperated as you. Imperiex has accused god-knows-how-many users of stalking his edits, which has always been counterproductive to the ethos of a Wiki - a place where we build on each others' edits. Calebchiam Talk 03:43, November 23, 2014 (UTC)
Say, feel free to go through these when you get the chance. Calebchiam Talk 03:51, November 23, 2014 (UTC)
Just a heads-up. Don't forget to remove the links to the images after you delete them. Small-resolution images aren't reason enough for deleting an image by the way, see Season 3 for example of their use. It was still right to delete them since they were unused in the mainspace nevertheless. Calebchiam Talk 04:09, November 23, 2014 (UTC)

Re:Admin Query[]

Yeah, it's like you expect something and it turns out to be something else entirely. But that's the fun part. Anyway, it depends on you entirely. I don't know if you are aware of this page or not (, but whenever you can remember, you can go to this page and just take a look at the Maintenance Reports. Working on the various categories on this page is the actual janitorial work on the wiki. RaghavD'"Look into my eyes. It’s where my demons hide" 15:35, November 25, 2014 (UTC)

Of course. You can take your time. The pages aren't going anywhere. :P RaghavD'"Look into my eyes. It’s where my demons hide" 16:04, November 25, 2014 (UTC)

Oh, right. I did see them. Should've said something. They are actually good and would be awesome if implemented. I don't know about how popular the References idea would be though. Not saying that it is bad, but people would find it a lot of work to keep adding citations. It isn't any work at all honestly, but people these days have the attention span of a goldfish.RaghavD'"Look into my eyes. It’s where my demons hide" 16:25, November 25, 2014 (UTC)


Hey, regarding blocks like these, do note that indefinite blocks are never given to IP addresses under any circumstances. First-vandalism merits at most a 1- or 3-day block. Repeated vandalism, maybe a week. IP addresses are not static, so they may be reassigned to other connections, i.e. you may inadvertently block someone in the future who hasn't even had a chance to make an edit. There's also the fact that simple page vandalism is never serious enough to merit that harsh a response anyhow. Cheers. (: Calebchiam Talk 15:54, November 27, 2014 (UTC)

Don't worry about it, the other admins and I are here to provide guidance. You're doing fine. Calebchiam Talk 15:54, December 1, 2014 (UTC)


How you doing, it's been a while? This user keeps removing omnipotence from powers and abilities sections on pages, saying it's not a power, when it means to be able to do anything, which fits well under these sections. Can you block them for a time if they keep doing it? -- ImperiexSeed, 1:13 AM, November 29th 2014

How about instead of listing "Omnipotence" as a power, we say that they have it on their power summary? That way, we are claiming that they have it, but we aren't falsing listing it as a power that they have. 19:58, November 29, 2014 (UTC)


Hello FTWinchester, this is EmpyreanSmoke. I left a message for you on my talk page. Could you please take a look and respond to it? Thanks!

Hello, EmpyreanSmoke here again. I read your response, and have a couple questions. So if I am correct, you are saying that posting things at the same time won't help anything. I understand why you don't think that is an accurate way to prove my innocence, so I will try to think of something else. Perhaps I could upload a photo of all of us, but I don't think my cousins or I want to put that kind of personal stuff on the wiki. Without sharing private information or uploading photos, I'm not sure how we can prove we are innocent...I kind of have to agree with my cousin (SuperBossNatural7's) logic though. I have explained that I am not a sock puppet user, and I explained what really happened. The most fair way to judge this would be "innocent until proven guilty". I told the truth about what happened, and there isn't any evidence going against my explanation. As there is no evidence that my explanation was false, and therefore no evidence that I am guilty of doing these things, there is no evidence that I am guilty. Therefore, me being punished is unjust, as nothing shows that I am guilty. Almost everyone, if not everyone, agrees that "innocent until proven guilty" is the most fair way to judge anything, and I am almost certain that you know that. 02:44, December 1, 2014 (UTC)

Alright, I understand your reasoning. I think I have a solution that might be able to sort this out. Since I am blocked, I will need you to help me out with it though. Can you please create a blog post, and ask users whether or not it should be "innocent until proven guilty" or "guilty until proven innocent". This will let the communty decide what is fair. I have a paragraph writen out for you to put on the blog post. If you accept, and agree to make the blog, let me know, and I will send you the paragraph. 16:30, December 1, 2014 (UTC)

No, I can't post anything on the blog, because I am blocked. I set up my bureaucrat request on a blog, so that is a perfect place to do this. As I can't create a blog of my own, I am requesting that you please post a blog post on my behalf, so we can let the wiki decide if I am innocent or guilty. I have a the blog already typed out, so if you kindly accept to do this, I will leave the message on your talk page.

Please post this on the blog that you made.

When I (EmpyreanSmoke) requested to become a bureaucrat, my cousins (LittleOl'Me and SuperBossNatural7) were some of the various people who voted in my favor. When Calebchiam saw that they shared the same IP address as me (because we made all accounts in the same place), he assumed that they were sockpuppet accounts created by me. I have given the explanation to all of this in full detail, but users are ignoring it because I haven't proved it. The thing is, it is impossible to prove that they are my cousins. Because of this, I have no evidence to back up my story. But also, there is no evidence disproving my story either. Please tell me, which is the more fair judging system? "Guilty until proven innocent" or "innocent until proven guilty"? I would argue the ladder, and so would most other human beings. I am almost certain you would too. Since I am sure we can all agree that "innocent until proven guilty" is the most fair judging system, we have to apply that in this situation. There is no evidence I can provide that my story is true, yet there is no evidence that my story is false either. Since there is no evidence my story is false, and no evidence that I am guilty, I remain innocent. Please comment what you think is more fair; "innocent until proven guilty" or "guilty until proven innocent"?

Another Vandal[]

this anon keeps vandalizing The Things We Left Behind Gabriel456 (talk) 03:15, December 3, 2014 (UTC)

Re: Amin Query[]

I don't know who designed the main page, but each section that you see there is a template. To access the main page navigation (It's called the Slider) you've got to go to RaghavD'"Look into my eyes. It’s where my demons hide" 13:43, December 4, 2014 (UTC)


Hello, EmpyreanSmoke here. You told me that you didn't care about the block, and would unblock me if other well established users agreed. So far, ImperiexSeed, RagHavD, and NaiflidG agree that I should be unblocked. Also, Gourgeist told me that in his views, he would have me unblocked. He told me that he will agree with you if you say you want me unblocked. I showed him our conversation where you said you didn't care about me being blocked, but he said that he wanted to see you formally say it. Can you please leave a comment on the blog post saying that you would be fine with me being unblocked, and would like to see what others think? Thanks in advance.


Thanks for helping me get unblocked. I know it caused a lot of drama, and took a lot of our time and energy, so I just wanted to thank you. And yes, my passion and dedication will always stay true. EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 21:50, December 7, 2014 (UTC)

Re:Mainpage and Slider[]

Hey, there's no reason for it actually. Feel free to change it as necessary. Cheers. Calebchiam Talk 03:51, December 18, 2014 (UTC)

Which two templates are you talking about? You don't have to worry about the Main Page at all. Just edit the Slider template every week. The Main Page and the Slider work well without any hitch. I'm not sure I understood your question completely. Just elaborate a little more please. RaghavD'"Look into my eyes. It’s where my demons hide" 14:57, December 18, 2014 (UTC)


Did a history comparison and it seems alright. I did move it to the questions section though, so that may have been the source of the confusion. Calebchiam Talk 13:46, December 20, 2014 (UTC)


I am trying to silence a longtime cyberbully who left a taunting message on my page this morning after viciously vandalizing my own wiki of my work, and is now playing dumb in order to goad me into confronting her. Please ban both of the troll's accounts immediately. Moleman 9000 22:16, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

The user above me keeps bullying me by deleting my comments on OTHER people's pages and is also slandering me by dragging me into a dumb conspiracy theory he has cooked up. Gentle-Willowtree (talk) 22:22, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

Ban both User:JaneSmithfield and User:Gentle-Willowtree immediately. Moleman 9000 22:25, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

ResonX, you can NOT delete messages posted on any talk page. Additionally, I couldn't see any clear form of bullying from any of their posts. Gentle-Willowtree only greeted you happy holidays.

Gentle-Willowtree, do NOT put my entire talk page as a candidate for speedy deletion.

Both of you, elaborate on your claims as to why the other is bullying you. FTWinchester (talk) 22:35, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

I caught that one, ResonX. Again, nobody is allowed to remove somebody else's message on talk pages unless it is outright vulgar or obvious vandalism. I could not see any clear indication Gentle-Willowtree is bullying you. Please elaborate. FTWinchester (talk) 22:37, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

My apologies, I didn't intend to mark your page as candidate for deletion. I might have misclicked when undoing Moleman's silencing on my comment by accident. I have no idea what this pyscho's problem is. Gentle-Willowtree (talk) 22:39, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

The bullying was not committed here, it was committed on numerous other sites, in this case here, here and here, this incident being only the very most recent in a long history of vicious harassment. The message left to me here was left immediately after the vandalism there. See the "contributions", including "Deleted contributions", under each.

An example of one of the accounts used for past vandalism and harassment would be this, which was also used on this Supernatural Wiki (see) to deny my truthful claims while I was trying to negotiate with General MGD on documenting the trolls' crimes on his site and to spread further lies about me, exactly as it is doing again right here and now.

Moleman 9000 22:44, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

That user appears to be IP banned Moleman9000. There is no way they could come back, especially as another person as they are IP banned. Stop making things up okay? I just wished holiday wishes for everyone and you went totally pyscho. I just don't want to be silenced! Gentle-Willowtree (talk) 22:46, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

Addendum: You also threatened to hack me and just started spouting gibberish like a mentally ill person! Gentle-Willowtree (talk) 22:47, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

Bullshit. Willow Giovanna and the other bullies associated with her have a long history of abusing TOR software to bypass rightful bans and continue their abuse. She also has an extensive history of lying to people's faces when called to answer for her crimes, as she is doing right now. Here is another example of an account of hers used to attack and blackmail me: [1] Moleman 9000 22:49, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

Unfortunately, tracing IP addresses and checking for proxies is beyond me. However, I would like to inquire more about a few examples ResonX has posted, and I would like Gentle-Willowtree to explain as to why a few of his posts were replaced either by a photo, one really nasty comment, whereas a couple were replaced by what seems like a holiday greeting. On one hand, I could pass the holiday greetings as unintentionally replacing the entire content but in the goodwill of wishing happy holidays, but the first two cases seem intentionally malicious. FTWinchester (talk) 22:54, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

Because as I said before, he left a threatening email to me, accusing me of being a friend of mine and a co-worker who I work with. I have no relation to his prior trolling, if such a thing exists. He just sorta lumped me in with everyone and started spamming my email with a bunch of threats. So I kinda snapped (he was doing it for quite some time) and just spammed stuff that I had found by googling his name and stuff. I only did that really recent 3 or two edits on his own wiki because he was spamming my email.

Also what the heck is TOR? Gentle-Willowtree (talk) 22:56, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

Let's see her explain THIS and THIS. Moleman 9000 22:58, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

I just said I had found those pics online and had posted them on your wiki because you were bullying me and spamming my email with harassment stuff. Maybe you should consider people's feelings more and stop out-and-outright BULLYING them online! I may have overreacted, but you kept sexually harassing me via spam! Gentle-Willowtree (talk) 23:01, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

She is flat-out playing dumb and flat-out lying, the same way she did under this account, which alluded to the same elaborate lies of me having stolen from the bullies' original work to spite them when the exact opposite is the case, and created two wikis perpetuating those lies, both now closed but visible under her "Favorite Wikis". Moleman 9000 23:02, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

Gentle-Willowtree, please post supporting evidence to your claims. From my point of view (I'm trying to be as impartial as I can), I have observed several users active here and in Moleman's epic rap battles wiki who appear to post nothing but spam on ResonX's talk page. FTWinchester (talk) 23:04, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

I never once spammed or harassed Willow except in direct response to her own harassment. I have never emailed her once. She is out-and-outright lying to your face while claiming the exact opposite to be the case. Moleman 9000 23:04, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

I deleted most of the trash emails he sent me and I have no relation to what Willow (as in Willow Giovanna, my friend, not me, Gentle-Willowtree which is based on the tree) does with him. I somehow got caught in thier drama. If they posted stuff on his wiki, they did it for thier own reasons, I got dragged in because he contacted me out of the blue and went ballistic because I know them. I tried being telling him to stop, then revenged spammed his wiki, and then I tried being apologetic and wishing him happy holidays but nothing placates him. A cursory web search of his name brings this thing up though, so apparently he has a history of harassment or something. Gentle-Willowtree (talk) 23:08, December 23, 2014 (UTC)


I have no idea what you are saying you maniac! I just found that on Google!!1! Gentle-Willowtree (talk)

Checking for those claims (IP addresses, proxies, histories of pages outside the wiki) are out of my scope. I am withholding my judgment until I let other admins weigh in on this. But for the record, I do NOT appreciate all these new users 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 who have posted nothing worthwhile in the betterment of the wiki, nor the back and forth flame war and accusation that are going on. If you have issues about each other from other websites, I would very much prefer that you keep it there and away from our already controversy-ridden wikia, and to PLEASE STOP calling in more users/creating new accounts for the sake of having reinforcements.

Should all these continue, however, I am considering simply blocking all of you for the time being. AND yes, I have seen the photo. FTWinchester (talk) 23:22, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

I have no idea what is the deal with those other accounts and it appears Willow Giovanna's account is months old. MONTHS before I joined! I have no relation to these people and I agree they add absolutely nothing to your wiki. I just want to be free to be able to post without being silenced on OTHER PEOPLE's talkpages, by an idignant bully such as Reson X. I respect your decision. Gentle-Willowtree (talk) 23:27, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

Chat please?[]

Can me, you, and I guess Reson X discuss all this in chat? It's exhausting to have to go back and forth on talk pages and keep up with it all.

I choose not to do so. These things need to be publicly and transparently settled. FTWinchester (talk) 22:54, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

Well you could always screencap the stuff or use the snipping tool from windows 7 and later, but I understand and respect your reasoning. Gentle-Willowtree (talk) 22:57, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

Absolute proof[]

Let's see her explain THIS and THIS. Moleman 9000 22:58, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

That Willow person is a real bitch. Moleman9000 told me about how he wants to strangle and mutilate her, and I agree with him. She deserves it, believe me. She deserves more than just an article on the RLVillians wiki. JeremiahOrtiz (talk) 23:03, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

^A new user with just the above post as the only contribution. This does not look pretty and is hard to accept on its own. FTWinchester (talk) 23:06, December 23, 2014 (UTC)


That's cause I never edit on this wiki, and I know who these cyberbullys are. They will dox you, and spam you with calls. They even send pizzas to your house when you don't want them. They are evil and need to be exterminated by you and Moleman9000.JeremiahOrtiz (talk) 23:09, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

And both "JaneSmithfield" and "Gentle-Willowtree" were created on Wikia within the past 24 hours. Moleman 9000 23:12, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

Have you not seen those hideous pictures? Please tell me you did ASAP so I can re-delete them. Moleman 9000 23:15, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

I didn't make those pictures! I only found them on google via Shadowness when I googled your name! Also that Jeremiah Ortiz person is being very rude! Gentle-Willowtree (talk) 23:18, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

More evidence[]

See this, an outright threat in which Willow refers to herself by name and describes gleefully murdering me. Moleman 9000 23:18, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

Also ask General MGD about this; he knows a lot. Moleman 9000 23:18, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

Joviana is Willow! As in my friend Willow, not my username only Gentle-Willowtree! I have no control over what she does! Stop assuming everything is related! Gentle-Willowtree (talk) 23:20, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

I'M NOT BEING RUDE WILLOW. I'm telling him the truth you cyberbully. Go back to cyberbullyland.:( JeremiahOrtiz (talk) 23:23, December 23, 2014 (UTC)


Have a look at THIS. This account was created by Willow Giovanna on an alternative art site, which she FOLLOWED me to to harass me and post hate art there. The same hate art could be found on the putrid cunt's other accounts on various sites, all of which were created specifically to harass me. Moleman 9000 23:24, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

Checking for those claims (IP addresses, proxies, histories of pages outside the wiki) are out of my scope. I am withholding my judgment until I let other admins weigh in on this. But for the record, I do NOT appreciate all these new users 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 who have posted nothing worthwhile in the betterment of the wiki, nor the back and forth flame war and accusations that are going on. If you have issues about each other from other websites, I would very much prefer that you keep it there and away from our already controversy-ridden wikia, and to PLEASE STOP calling in more users/creating new accounts for the sake of having reinforcements.

Should all these continue, however, I am considering simply blocking all of you for the time being. AND yes, I have seen the photo. FTWinchester (talk) 23:22, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

Then please simply stop necessitating the continuing of Willow's lying by banning her and reporting her to Wikia and any other possibly authorities. Moleman 9000 23:28, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

He's telling us to drop it, Reson X. Just let it go. No more bullying and no more flame wars. Can't you see its tearing this wiki apart? It's time to be MATURE and set aside your differences with me, and calm down. Gentle-Willowtree (talk) 23:33, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

I have been TRYING to move past your harassment. This latest incident was completely unprovoked on your part. Moleman 9000 23:34, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

Look, I was wrong for vandalizing your wiki because of your email harassment. But you have to let it go now. Gentle-Willowtree (talk) 23:37, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

Yes, I would really appreciate it if you two just own up to both your mistakes and just stop adding fuel to the flame. Both of you please be the better men and forgive. I have notified the other admins, but if this is resolved here that would be great. And stop it with those disgusting photos for goodness' sake. FTWinchester (talk) 23:42, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

Alright. Moleman, I formally apologize to you for slightly vandalizing your wiki because I was upset at your accusations. I hope you will apologize for your sickening email spam and accusing me of being a troll, but I'm probably expecting to much. But I do not wish to continue fighting this pointless fight of mistaken identities. Gentle-Willowtree (talk) 23:46, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

What email spam? Moleman 9000 23:51, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

The ones that you said I should be sent to the gas chamber to answer for my crimes and that I should be cut into pieces after being r*ped. And also lobotimized. Gentle-Willowtree (talk) 23:54, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

Those are all things YOU said of ME, and I can prove it. Let's see your "evidence".

My evidence is how you treat me in general and besides, like I said, I'm done fighting you. You can choose to be an adult and move on, or you can continue to whine like an angry baby. The latter is not productive to this wiki however and I frown on it greatly along with the staff. You need to stop bullying. That's all I'll say at this point. Gentle-Willowtree (talk) 00:09, December 24, 2014 (UTC)

Your folly[]

The error being committed by you right now is that you seem to be under the impression that what is happening is a two-sided feud where both sides have points. This is not the case. Willow Giovanna is a vicious, lying, sadistic, sociopathic bully who victimizes and psychologically torments good people for fun. She STOLE and actively undermined my original body of work, has a long history of lying and abusing false identities to manipulate people just like you even when morally cornered like she is now, and attacked me in this instance, and in direct collaboration with other bullies, with zero provocation.

Please simply ban both of her current accounts and if possible archive these exchanges. Moleman 9000 23:50, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

Sigh. You are really wierd. I just apologized and you still accuse me of being Willow Giovanna. I'm not her. Your battle is with her, not me. Please just leave me along and drop this issue. Poor FTWinchester is probably stressed because of this crazy battle you've dragged us all into. Please let it go. Gentle-Willowtree (talk) 23:53, December 23, 2014 (UTC)

"Let it go" was the message Willow gave when I was reporting her under her previous account. Without me further responding after said message, she later led an all-out vandalism raid against both my wiki sites. Said account also claimed itself to merely be a "friend" of Willow only to later prove itself to be her herself through continued cyberbullying. Moleman 9000 00:10, December 24, 2014 (UTC)

Let it go is a popular phrase since Frozen dude. Gentle-Willowtree (talk) 00:11, December 24, 2014 (UTC)

More proof still[]

See this vandalized revision of an article on my site by "Gentle-Willowtree": [2]

Now look at the link given in that version of the page: [3] This is a known trolling and bullying site from which the harassment of me led by Willow originated. At the bottom of this page, there is a new post from Willow herself under her common alias "Candy" with a screenshot of the current conversations on this very site.

Moleman 9000 00:23, December 24, 2014 (UTC)

All I see is Willow ie not me, screencapping and posting your whiney self important post on Empyreansmoke's page. I linked it because I know that it would have pissed you off after you sent those sexually harassing messages towards me before. Gentle-Willowtree (talk) 00:25, December 24, 2014 (UTC)

> "Sexually harassing messages"

EVIDENCE OR IT DID NOT HAPPEN. Moleman 9000 00:29, December 24, 2014 (UTC)

That rip-off report I posted mentioned that you have sent sexually harassing messages to people before! Gentle-Willowtree (talk) 00:34, December 24, 2014 (UTC)

YOU WROTE THAT "REPORT", WILLOW. Moleman 9000 00:36, December 24, 2014 (UTC)

Willow might have, but not me. Gentle-Willowtree (talk) 00:38, December 24, 2014 (UTC)

He's doing it again...after I apologized[]

After I apologized! He is deleting my comments on other people's pages, not his own! Reson X does not respect your authority! Gentle-Willowtree (talk) 00:33, December 24, 2014 (UTC)

I'm tired of this! Clearly you just can't be levelheaded and mature and drop everything. The chat is a mess and given recent histories of accused/suspicious sockpuppet accounts, I could very well also see that the chat is being used to make it seem that both camps are ganging up on each other. FTWinchester (talk) 00:41, December 24, 2014 (UTC)

I want to get away from this! He just keeps coming after me and deleting my messages! Gentle-Willowtree (talk) 00:43, December 24, 2014 (UTC)

Hey. I know about as much as you as to what is going on. All I know is that ResonX keeps saying that WillowTree is bullying him (which I haven't seen at all), and then he keeps deleting his messages on talk pages (including mine). There have been about twenty reverts on my talk page alone. I see no evidence of Willowtree bullying him, and if he ever did, he stopped. I think the best move would be to shortly ban ResonX from talk pages, and tell him he needs to stop. EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 01:16, December 24, 2014 (UTC)


Hmm. I am reading and thinking of a more permanent solution. But, maybe we can send protype message to all users in this argument. (Please, reframe from sending messages or deleting messages from talk pages; that is against wikia policies. Unless, it has to deal with the wikia, than it might be positive to reframe from sending messages. If the arguments continues please contact one of your admins.) Now it's rough and don't have to use it. I'll read more to see what The argument is more about.[[User:Twilight Despair 5|]] ([[The God of Creation]]) (talk) 03:03, December 24, 2014 (UTC)

I will get back to you in a day or two at the maximum. RaghavD'"Look into my eyes. It’s where my demons hide" 07:45, December 25, 2014 (UTC)

Oh. I'm glad to know that the issue's been solved. Hope you had fun on Christmas! RaghavD'"Look into my eyes. It’s where my demons hide" 13:16, December 27, 2014 (UTC)

Dogs and bees[]

Seeing as how CalebChiam thinks it's ok for the wiki to have pages on Ruby's quite inconspicuous vessels (which I didn't agree with) that can't quite be detailed, can I make pages on animals such as dogs, bees, etc that have appeared in multiple episodes, or no? I wouldn't have even thought about making pages for them before, but seeing as Calebchiam backed up Tyson on the pages, I think it's fairly reasonable to create animal pages despite any variance in the meatiness of these pages. -- ImperiexSeed, 1:40 PM, December 26th 2014

Disambiguation Pages[]

I'm thinking of creating disambiguation pages for the names "Charlie" and "Nora". However, there is a slight problem. The namespace for those names are already in use. With the name Charlie, the namespace is used by a Season 1 character and in regards to the name Nora, the namespace is used by a character from Season 5.

This means that I have to come up with a new namespace for these 2 characters. What would be an appropriate namespace for these character? Would the following titles be acceptable: "Charlie" to "Charlie (Human)" and "Nora" to "Nora (Witch)" I ask because it seems weird to me to use those title because there is more than one Charlie that is human and in regards to Nora, there are 2 witches with the name Nora (the other witch just happened to have a last name). - JoyaOscura (talk) 22:35, December 26, 2014 (UTC)

ResonX is Back[]

Hey FTW. I'm sorry to say that the wiki peace was only temporary, becuase ResonX made a new account named BennyCupster. He left a message on my talk page confirming that it was him, and he continued to go on about the bully thing. Could you please block him and his IP adress? Thanks. EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 21:34, December 27, 2014 (UTC)

Another Disambig Question[]

When it comes to disambiguation pages, is it allowed to point to articles that features the disambiguated name in the title but is not the actually name of the object/place/person?

An example is the name Lily. There's a character named Lily Shoemaker. She had a friend who was featured in the episode with her but the friend's name is never revealed. Therefore, the article for this character is titled Lily's Friend. Am I allowed to put the link to the "Lily's Friend" article on the disambiguation page "Lily" or would it be better to leave the article out of the page?

Another example would be Gary's Coven and Gary's Witchcraft Book. The title of the articles features the name Gary, but that's not the actually name of the group/book. -JoyaOscura (talk) 20:10, December 28, 2014 (UTC)

Re: Hello[]

Hey there!! :D Of course! It's what I'm trying to focus on most at the moment! Happy New Year!!! I really hope you enjoyed your holidays! ^___^ Gourgeist (talk) 06:44, January 1, 2015 (UTC)

Hate to say it[]

But Moleman seems to not have learned his lessons. He is still deleting talk page messages even after being warned not to. Is there anyway you can get him into chat? I've actually thought up some peaceful solutions to the matter if you'd be willing to hear them. Scombridae (talk) 01:31, January 2, 2015 (UTC)

Setting things straight.[]

You and the other users of this site have been deceived.

User:ResonX2 is not me. It is a sockpuppet created by the group of vicious cyberbullies led by Willow Giovanna for the sole purpose of undermining me here. I said none of the horrible things it said in chat while claiming to be me.

Furthermore, all of the non-regular users present in chat during that incident, including User:OneHamMan, User:MAJOR KOMAROV, User:AutismPirate and User:Whinayayay (a sock puppet of the previously-banned-for-harassment User:Whinaaay), are all members of said trolling group. This is provable from the accounts' previous history consisting of repeatedly vandalizing my personal sites.

The conspiracy nature of this is also evident from the fact that the entire incident was posted on a website operated by the bullies and dedicated to attacking and defaming me, here.

And now, the troll accounts User:ChingWhinWhon and User:Scombridae are repeatedly vandalizing my talk page with "chastisement" for "my" actions, repeatedly re-adding their spamming messages whenever I remove them, and claiming that I cannot moderate my own talk page.

I don't exactly have a right to bring you to active involvement in going after these criminals outside this site, but I do want the record to be set straight here with the ResonX account unbanned just for reference while all the offending accounts are permanently banned, and for it to be understood that I did not say those horrible things.

BennyCupster (talk) 03:51, January 2, 2015 (UTC)

Wow, now you are lying. First you try to threaten your way into taking over FTWinchester's position and now you want you're trying to lie to him and manipulate him? That's really fucking low dude. Scombridae (talk) 03:55, January 2, 2015 (UTC)

You are ResonX2, @BennyCupster. You admitted it to me in a chatroom where I pretended to be an ally. I screencapped it ( I feel like I could've gotten more out of you, but unfortunately I had something urgent to do. None of my friends threatened to kill or rape anyone, nor have we done any of the horrible things ResonX has claimed we've done. ResonX is just taking advantage of people again inorder to attack Willow Giovanna, including everyone that associates with her. He has a history of giving out death threats to several people( What happened in chat is typical of ResonX. Your final solution is to just ban ResonX on sight(and yes, even us) and ignore him, if he tries to talk with any of you. 06:03, January 2, 2015 (UTC)

Seriously? Another forgery? That is literally a CRIME, dude. BennyCupster (talk) 14:28, January 2, 2015 (UTC)

Oh sure every piece of evidence against you is a forgery, right ResonX? I think I need to make it clear to all administrators of this wiki that ResonX's death threats are nothing out of the ordinary. I can recall several people ResonX has threatened to kill over trivial matters. For instance, here's a private talk session from deviantART where two victims of ResonX's death threats talk about their experiences ( When things don't go the way ResonX wants them, he can get angry to the extent of wanting to kill the people responsible. And now, he's trying to blame his threats on us, which is just completely unacceptable. A false accusation like that can't just be allowed to slide, seeing how you all reacted very seriously to it. I personally don't take any of his threats seriously, and neither should any of you. Afterall, he doesn't have the resources to act on them. He's more than likely just gonna deny anything I've written on this talk-page. I've never been able to get through to him, and neither are any of you. Just ban him, so that you can all just get back to writing without having to deal with his disruptive antics(And ours, I'm not gonna deny that we've been very disruptive on this wiki, and I apologize for it.). 21:01, January 2, 2015 (UTC)

If you don't want me to attack you, then stop harassing me and making false accusations towards me. Also, why would you have that last document, created by the known troll "Jews", if you were not part of the trolling circles he, Willow Giovanna and others are involved in?

In any case, the fact remains that both "incidents" pertaining to the current situation, both the chat incident here with "ResonX2" and the previously linked screencap in which "ResonX" admits to it, are forgeries created by trolls, which the IP address above is unambiguously one of. BennyCupster (talk) 21:08, January 2, 2015 (UTC) BennyCupster (talk) 21:08, January 2, 2015 (UTC)

ResonX, you can keep repeating the same lie, over and over agian but that doesn't make it true. Not without evidence. I give evidence when I accuse someone of doing something, but when you do, the burden of proof is always on you. In this case, I am accusing you of having a history of giving out death threats. I am accusing you of threatening to kill the administrators of this wiki. I've given out evidence in the form of screenshots, and logs. Where's your evidence, ResonX? 22:08, January 2, 2015 (UTC)

My evidence consists of the presence of multiple known cyberbullies with a history of deception and manipulation in coordination together here, in the form of accounts recorded as having been created to vandalize my sites, their activities of spamming my pages including with the address of a known bullying forum that has been repeatedly spammed to me, the posting of the forged logs impersonating me, as these troll have a history of doing, on a known trolling site, and the above IP address's possession of a very old trolling document that no legit user would be likely to have ready to present.

The key evidence for "ResonX2" not being me lies in the fact that it was created immediately upon the time of the incident in which it was involved despite myself already possessing multiple accounts, including this one, BennyCupster, which the administration of another site forced me to create or else be banned because of these trolls' nonstop harassment and vandalism.

I'm not trying to start a fight here or get other legit users involved in any dealings outside of this site, I'm simply exercising my right to have the truth known so we can leave this dealing soundly and with it being known that I did not say those horrible things, and that those saying I did are lying trolls. BennyCupster (talk) 23:27, January 2, 2015 (UTC)

It's quite obvious that you created ResonX2 immediately after you were banned so you could have a disposable sockpuppet and not risk getting your Bennycupster account banned too. With a throwaway sockpuppet, you had ampule opportunity to verbally abuse the admins without worrying about a global wikia ban. Since that didn't work, you've reverted to using Bennycupster and trying to plead your way out. Scombridae (talk) 01:12, January 3, 2015 (UTC)

Well after the chat with you on IRC, I whois'd your username, revealing your hostmask.( You're the only person I know that lives in southern california. Whose southern californian hostmask could this belong to, ResonX?

ResonX2 is not me. PERIOD. These people are LYING to you, as their kind has a HISTORY of doing. Scombridae can immediately be identified as a known troll based on his global user history consisting of the account being created specifically to vandalize my site. I've had enough of this. Please just ban these filth right now and get this madness over with so I can go on with my business in peace. BennyCupster (talk) 04:41, January 3, 2015 (UTC)

Enough, Moleman. 05:46, January 3, 2015 (UTC)

Looks like you've failed to refute your accusations, and still shamelessely deny mine, ResonX. Even after providing irrefutable proof. I Don't think it's necessary for me to continue. ResonX confirmed for threatening to kill the administrators of this wiki. I've said what needed to be said. 06:16, January 3, 2015 (UTC)

I repeat: RESONX2 IS NOT ME, IT IS A SOCKPUPPET OF TROLLS, STALKERS AND BULLIES WITH A LONG HISTORY OF LYING TO AUTHORITIES. I did not threaten anyone here. I ask permission to remove the records of these filth's lies for the sake of record; in any case, please just ban them for crying out loud so this can be over with. BennyCupster (talk) 06:22, January 3, 2015 (UTC)

Yeah, your a broken record, ResonX. Keep repeating the same bullshit over and over again. It won't smell any better. Oh, and the only way for this to really be over with, is by having you banned. Delete what the administrator allows you to, but the fact remains: You threatened to kill everyone, and are now asking the administrators you wanted dead to delete the evidence I brought into the light. You really do have something to hide, don't you, ResonX? Yeah, you totally do. 06:39, January 3, 2015 (UTC)

Repeating a lie over and over does not make it anything different. I did not threaten any administration, and the account that said those things is not me. PERIOD. BennyCupster (talk) 06:53, January 3, 2015 (UTC)

Stop bullshitting already. 06:55, January 3, 2015 (UTC)

Welp, this is a ride that won't ever end. I'll just leave it to the administrators. 07:07, January 3, 2015 (UTC)


I am TRYING to "drop it" and take leave; I am simply needing to make sure that it is understood that my "accusations" of trolling and bullying are true and that I did not say those horrible things to any of you. BennyCupster (talk) 18:10, January 2, 2015 (UTC)

Renaming the King of Hell[]

Hey, guy! I was renaming the "King of Hell" and "King of the Crossroads" pages "Ruler of Hell" and "Ruler of the Crossroads," respectively, as gender-neutral to accommodate Lilith (for both) and Abaddon (for Hell). While it worked out perfectly with the "King of the Crossroads" page (and its redirect, "Queen of the Crossroads," which I re-redirected directly to "Ruler of the Crossroads"), it looks like I messed up somehow when renaming the "King of Hell" page. The Talk page and the History page still refer to it as "King of Hell," and while the page seems to have technically been renamed "Ruler of Hell," it doesn't show as a redirect in the URL and typing "Ruler_of_Hell" into the wiki URL results in an empty page, while "King_of_Hell" gets the right page -- though, again, it doesn't show it as a redirect, even though it should.

The only difference I noticed was that the box that should exist at the Rename screen, to rename the associated Talk page, didn't seem to show up when I was trying to move it. Another issue was that I had to repeatedly try to rename both pages, and then refresh it, to change the name because "a page of that name already exists, or the name you have chosen is not valid." I'm not sure if either had something to do with the problems with the King of Hell page (though the Ruler of the Crossroads page ended up having no problems), or both did, or something else entirely. At any rate, could you be able to fix it with the admin tools? And if you figure out what the trouble was, could you tell me so that I can avoid having the same problems in the future? Thanks, and sorry for the trouble!--NaiflidG (talk) 10:26, January 3, 2015 (UTC)

No worries, it wasn't a big thing and the response isn't really late anyway ("late" for me would be over a week). I'm okay; I'd been so disillusioned with SPN under Carver that I turned into a bit of a ghost on this site, but I think I might be starting to get more active again. There's still a lot that I'd planned to do on here. I hope you're doing well and that you enjoyed the holidays. How's admining been so far? (Looks like it might be kind of a headache.) Anyway, getting back on-topic: I checked the page and you fixed the problem, so thank you! With luck, I'll get on editing both pages in the next few days. As long as we're discussing them, there were a few points I wanted to hear from the other users on, so if you have the time and inclination, could you weigh in on the Talk pages for RotC and RoL? And don't worry, I'm always awesome. You stay awesome yourself. :)--NaiflidG (talk) 05:37, January 6, 2015 (UTC)

Gary from Wendigo[]

Hi there. Could you please delete these pages so I can make room for the Gary portrayed by Cory Monteith in Wendigo? Thank you. Gourgeist (talk) 00:32, January 4, 2015 (UTC)

Oh hey, forget that request actually, it is now a disambiguation page. :) Thank ya anyway! Gourgeist (talk) 23:07, January 4, 2015 (UTC)

Thanks for the welcome! I was very active on the Fallout Wikia for years and I believe I am still ranked #37, so I have a great understanding of how it works. RoccoUser talk:GlassJAw667 20:50, January 5, 2015 (UTC)

Thank you. I adore how maturely you deal with these situations. Also, I've been quite busy as well with festivities, lol. Also you might want to consider other parties acting inappropriately in this mess. Thanks again. ^__^ Gourgeist (talk) 08:02, January 6, 2015 (UTC)


I am no longer trying to press my issues on this site; at this point all I am doing is protecting my talk page from vandalism. BennyCupster (talk) 01:42, January 6, 2015 (UTC)

Just letting you know that Bennycupster has been deleting and reverting edits again.

Joviana-Dulce (talk) 00:56, January 8, 2015 (UTC)

Hey, I've just reported Moleman9000/Bennycupster to the Wikia Admin Contacts for repeated ban-evasion, responding to trolls, and cross-wiki drama. Hopefully this huge mess will be over soon. 19:15, January 8, 2015 (UTC)

Guidance, please :)[]

I'm hoping to get some guidance from you, since it looks like you're the admin with the most edits for this wiki. Let me know if I should be asking someone else. I started watching Supernatural last month, so I'm new to the show. I've set up wikis for work (software developer), and personal stuff, for years, I've just never used one as a guide while watching a show before. I've been editing the pages as I watched episodes for the past couple of weeks, mostly clean up, sometimes adding quotes, correcting typos, linking to content, and adding locations. I just came across a different article format, and now I'm confused.

I saw your comments on the main Talk page, where you mentioned using an "in-universe point of view", and through Season 9, First Born, there's a "Characters" section, right after the plot. But starting with Sharp Teeth (and for as many following episodes as I clicked through to), there's a "Cast" section at the very top. I like the Characters section way, but that made me wonder if there's been a change in how the pages are supposed to be formatted?

I have been looking for a guide on how the episode pages are supposed to be, since I started editing, but I haven't found anything. Even the "About" page of the wiki is empty. Is there a concise style guide for this community? Saintless77 (talk) 22:42, January 13, 2015 (UTC)

Thanks for your reply. All of the episodes up to First Born that I saw (since maybe season 3 or 4) had the Characters section below the Plot, and then it looks like someone started putting "Cast" above it instead, with at least the episodes following Sharp Teeth in Season 9. The "Cast" version always has the actor name and the character name listed, and doesn't seem to differentiate between major and minor characters, the way they had been. And those articles seem to also take you out of the story a lot more, with details like the actors names in the plot, and references to other things they did. I haven't watched S10E1, yet, so I haven't looked at that one. But, I very much liked the way that it was being done before, and it lent to the story-telling point of view, when reading the Plot, as opposed to technical details, which used to be below.

If there's no official style guide, I'd really like to edit them, to put the information in the same order. Most of what I've been doing is cleanup, like adding formatting, so the quotes are easier to read, and linking characters or other pages up. I've stopped doing much of that, until I got an answer, because I wasn't sure how protective people get over stuff, and I would have hated to make edits like that, and then find out that there was some official guide for it.

I plan to watch the series again - I'm already re-watching at a much slower pace with my younger son, so I am sure I'll edit again, as we go. Saintless77 (talk) 04:55, January 14, 2015 (UTC)

Thanks :)

Hey FTW, how are you? Could you please change the name of the "Soul doppelgänger" page to "Soul splitting"? This is a much more accurate title, as this key splits the soul into two, instead of merely creating a clone. Thanks EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 21:18, February 1, 2015 (UTC)

Re: Thanks[]

Oh wow, your kindness is appreciated friend! ^___^ No problem! Only trying to make sure that the rules are apparent in a wiki where they're often forgotten. Gourgeist (talk) 11:34, February 7, 2015 (UTC)

Haha I suck too! I have a good friend who I talk to a lot who makes fun of me for it, too. It's always on my mind about how bad I am lol. -w- I'm done with the Delta Episode (if you're playing OR/AS) so now I might have a second chance at breeding, as XY distracted me from that with all the fun gadgets/new Pokemon introduced.

Sorry if I sound off, I've been awake for 2 days and am only alive on coffee (School). But yes, Machamp is ugly lol. xD Just kidding. I'd like to see you go up against me with him! I haven't gone online since I bought Omega Ruby. Oh sorry, I haven't caught up with Supernatural, I was under the impression that it truly went to crap, but hopefully that's changed? :) And a lot of my male friends have been talking about Swift recently lol! I'm tempted to take a listen now.

Sorry for the paragraphs, I'm high on coffee as I said, hope to talk to you soon again. :) Gourgeist (talk) 11:52, February 7, 2015 (UTC)

Yup, synergy was one of the primary reasons I was discouraged from competitive battle in the last game.

Hmm, I'll take a look then! I do value the main plotline though for most shows I watch, and as a side note, I think Metatron should have been trashed seasons ago. I never liked the potential that was thrown away with him but keeping him this long? Also - Season 11? Are they serious? Am I the only one that sees this as an obvious moneygrab? Supernatural is the only show keeping the CW alive I believe. I don't want the show to truly be milked until the nipples are nothing but scabs. But still, I've been meaning to catch up with one of my favorite shows, so I hope it won't disappoint. :'D

And you don't even need to explain further - I FEEL THAT SO MUCH. With every band I've ever liked, that usually happens. Gourgeist (talk) 12:40, February 7, 2015 (UTC)

Only a few months after finishing Season 5 was I certain that I didn't consider anything after Kripke as canon! I had a conversation with Imperiex about it years ago and he thought I was weird for thinking it because technically, everything on the show is canon, but of course there is Kripke's era and his is superior, so I just consider anything after it non-canon as well. ^___^ Funny thing is, now it seems he feels that way too, which is great. So glad to hear I'm not alone. My exact thinking is "Sam is still in the Cage, Dean lives a normal life". But of course that would be a sad ending, but overall, I think Kripke's era is isolated from later seasons. I'm so glad to hear I'm not alone in this thinking.

Also I see what you mean about the show! I kind of predicted that this would happen, too. It didn't seem like it was going anywhere in Season 9. They should have kept to the tablets storyline and ended the show there.

Oh no, of course! Take your time. I don't have a Pokemon in ORAS that's higher than like 70 I think. It's quite sad, I haven't been able to pick up my 3DS in a while because I'm bored of training. I'll pick up on it soon though. So take your time! ^__^ Gourgeist (talk) 22:14, February 9, 2015 (UTC)

Oh wow that's so cool! My sister also kind of felt that way when I'd bring it up. I think it's a commonly apparent thing among fans, once I think about it. And you're right, I'm so ashamed! So whenever you're ready to battle then, I'm available. :) Gourgeist (talk) 23:06, February 9, 2015 (UTC)

Welcome back! I'm doing school right now actually (online, of course). I'm logging on right now then, if that's okay with you. Gourgeist (talk) 13:14, February 15, 2015 (UTC)


I am new to this wiki, so can I get a link to the guidelines?Dream Inspiration2014 (talk) 12:54, February 9, 2015 (UTC)

I just watched the first episode of season 2 and I am just speechless. Dean almost died and John did die. This season looks more intense than the first.Dream Inspiration2014 (talk) 23:20, February 9, 2015 (UTC)


Quite irritatingly, users keep wrongly putting that Death, like God, is fully omnipotent, even when I've explained why he isn't. It's mind-numbingly clear that Death is not completely omnipotent at all (as is no character but God himself), just him being unable to erase the damage done to Sam's soul proves my point immediately, but to further exemplify my point, he also had to actually physically go and get Sam's soul from the cage instead of, say, thinking it and having it appear right next to him. Please get involved by locking the page or talking with them. Thanks. -- ImperiexSeed, 7:06 PM, February 9th 2015

An annoying anon[]

Can you do something about this anon? He/She keeps reverting Omnipotence on Death (and the Archangels for that matter) no matter how many times it's undone Gabriel456 (talk) 19:31, February 12, 2015 (UTC)

You're welcome, and thank you Gabriel456 (talk) 14:10, February 15, 2015 (UTC)

Re: Battle[]

Oh no sorry, I always say that when I mean a battle. :S I'm ready when you are then. ^__^ Gourgeist (talk) 13:28, February 15, 2015 (UTC)

No problem! Whichever you want. Gourgeist (talk) 14:02, February 15, 2015 (UTC)

Funny, one of my other wiki-related friends has a winter storm approaching and is from Canada. Oh well. :'D Gourgeist (talk) 14:04, February 15, 2015 (UTC)

I've heard that from friends but wouldn't know because it's always neutral here. And sure! Gourgeist (talk) 14:08, February 15, 2015 (UTC)


Can you please add the acheivement and leaderboards feature to this wiki please?Dream Inspiration2014 (talk) 11:27, February 16, 2015 (UTC)

Ok that is cool. The blog would be perfect. Also I noticed there are no comments section on the pages.Dream Inspiration2014 (talk) 11:33, February 16, 2015 (UTC)


Hey FTW, how's it going? If you wouldn't mind, could you please unlock the poll archive for a little bit, so I can add a poll? Thanks.


Ok I just finished episode 13 of season 2 and that really scared me. The whole angel thing really made me creeped out. I am enjoying this season better than the first. Chad - Dream big & be big.   10:57, February 28, 2015 (UTC)

Simple request for the record[]

Could you please remove the block on my main account, User:ResonX, wrongfully imposed for the actions of bullies impersonating me? It currently says I left death threats, etc. when I did not, and I would like this fixed for the record even though I am not a regular user here. BennyCupster (talk) 17:12, March 6, 2015 (UTC)

Chuck as God[]

When is "Chuck" officially known as God? I'm so confused. Do the characters not know but the viewers should and I missed something? Or what? Thanks I'm new to SN.

~Becky (talk) 02:50, March 8, 2015 (UTC)Becky411234



My name is Taya, i'm an admin & bureaucrat at I'm also a fan of SPN, and I really enjoy the show and the wikia.

I was wondering if you'd be willing to affiliate and collab on a project.

Inspired by the many family relationships in our show The 100, we wanted to do Family Week, highlighting a different relationship everytime. But ofcourse the Winchesters are like, the epithome of family on the CW so it would be cool to have you guys on board too. 

If we got (CW) Family Week on a bit of a promotional roll it could generate audiences for both of our show ;)

Kind Regards,

TotallyTinkerbell (talk) 17:46, March 12, 2015 (UTC) aka Taya

Season 3 Review[]

Ok so I have three episodes left of Supernatural season 3. I love the new additions of Ruby and Bella. They really add a kick to the Windchester boys. I love that Dean and Sam love each other more. Chad - Dream big & be big.   10:23, March 13, 2015 (UTC)

Is there a standard this wiki uses for what can be a page?[]

Hi. I have a question, is there a standard this wiki uses for what can be a page, if so, what? Cause, to be honest, it's starting to look like there is no real standard by which pages are created, where people can create pages for anything. Page creation should be credentialed by a certain standard, so, sorry, but Ruby's vessels wouldn't meet the standard if it was a proper standard. And even though we know that Meg's brunette vessel was an aspiring actress and that Lilith's blonde woman vessel was an dental hygienist, that's not nearly enough to structure a page around. So all these vessel pages should be deleted and we need to develop a standard by which we can evaluate if something should be given a page. Thanks. -- ImperiexSeed, 7:50 PM, March 14th 2015


I updated info about Sister Isabella. Her name is Catherine Michaud, and the IMDB's profile is

The IMDB's page about Paint It Black Episode is

Hope it helps.


I've been having edit wars with Trip391 or EmpyreanSmoke for a little bit now regarding Sam. The most latest being that I edited Susan Carter's page saying that she shook Dean's hand and thanked and I didn't include Sam because she never actually shook his hand or thanked him, but because they're trying to bolster and equalize Sam to Dean (when the show makes it clear that Dean's the center of everything), every edit I do on pages regarding Sam if it has to do with just Dean getting thanked, etc, and Sam being left out, they keep undoing it simply because they can't wrap their heads around the fact that Sam's just Dean's shadow and just there to everyone, whereas Dean's getting all the kisses, 'thank you's,' the best lines, the ladies, he's good with kids, etc. Or like how on Andrea Barr's page I portrayed the scene as her only thanking Dean and kissing him, but they changed that too even though she did only thank Dean. I'm just letting you know because you're probably be hearing from at least one of them soon. -- ImperiexSeed, 1:31 AM, April 28th 2015


Sorry to bother you FTWinchester, but over the past few days Imperiexseed's hatred of Sam has been spilling out of his blog, and affecting his writing of articles. While he doesn't like a character, and that's his opinion, I don't believe it's correct for him to be writing articles incorrectly simply because he doesn't like a character. When he changes what occurred in an episode when he edits articles, suggests articles be removed because they relate to Sam, or removes info from episodes when writing simply because he doesn't like a character, anyone who reads the site may be confused (as they may have just watched the episode and then see that the wiki on Supernatural has events written differently) and a little put off by it.

Now, I've mentioned to Imperiex that whether or not he likes a character or not should not affect the writing of his articles, as the information on a wiki should be written from a neutral point-of-view, and that if he had problems writing something because of his hatred of Sam, he may want to leave it to someone else who wouldn't be biased. I also suggested he use his blog for his bias as well, and while any conversation he has on their is not really civil, but at least casual people reading the site don't have to be bothered by it. Two other users (Empreyansmaoke and Twilight Despair 5) have also suggested he cool it with such biased editing, but he doesn't seem to care. I was wondering if maybe you, as an admin, could try to talk some sense into him, in an attempt to diffuse the situation. Thanks for your help. Trip391 (talk) 05:41, April 28, 2015 (UTC)

  • It seems that as I was typing this Imperiex also left you a message. He said this "I edited Susan Carter's page saying that she shook Dean's hand and thanked and I didn't include Sam because she never actually shook his hand or thanked him", but when watching the episode, you can see that after Susan shakes Dean's hand, she has to turn her body after shaking Sam's as well (this also makes sense since both brothers did help the Carter family). And he is correct when he says that when he's edited recently, and left information from out of an article, someone else has stepped in and corrected his incorrect and biased statement (he then starts edit warring against them). Trip391 (talk) 05:41, April 28, 2015 (UTC)

Admin rights[]

Hello, FTWinchester. As you know, I used to be an admin, but my rights were removed roughly 6 months ago due to a misunderstanding (this is an understatement, but it's probably best if we don't go into this again, as I don't was another argument to arise). The bureaucrat CalebChiam removed my rights due to this incident, and said that if you and the rest of the community agreed, that he would return my rights back. You guys agreed that I should get my rights back within a matter of months. I jumped the gun, and requested my rights back nearly a month later. I admit, that was foolish, selfish, and very impatient of me. I was really excited, which caused me to ask too quickly, but this is no excuse. Because I have learned from my mistake, I have waited nearly 6 months before requesting my rights again. As you agreed that I get the rights back within a matter of months, and I have waited for almost half a year, I think it would be fair that I request for my rights back. As an admin, I will never, and I mean never abuse my power. I hate it when this happens, and the last thing I want to do is afflict that on this wiki. I will work hard to make the design ship shape, make sure the content is 100% accurate, and keep the trolls and spammers away. Some people have accused me of wanting extra rights for a "power grab", but that is not it at all. I will admit, having admin rights make me feel nice, but that is not why I want them. I want them because I love Supernatural, and love being on this wiki. I want to help the wiki grow, and keep it at its best. I love graphic design, and so admin rights would allow me to edit the home page and background. Once again, the last thing I would do is use my rights for personal gain, and promise to only use them to help the wiki. So what do you say? Will you give me another shot as an admin? Imagine what it feels like to get another shot at doing something you love. Feel free to leave a comment on my blog. EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 16:22, May 2, 2015 (UTC)

I appreciate the fact that you would be willing to give me rollback rights. As you said "something small, for now", this implys that this would be temporary, and that I could become an admin afterwards. If we follow your suggestion, how long after would I be able to become an admin again?

While these rights would allow me to undo vandalism easier, I don't think they would help me accomplish what the wiki needs. With the admin rights, I would be able to do rollbacks, block users for multiple vandalisms, lock pages should they vandalized frequently, and improve the design of the wiki. As you said, the wiki needs another admin to help it, not just a rollbacker. I have experience with admin rights, and am editing on a frequent basis. I am am asking for another chance to use these rights to help the wiki. These rights are just as temperatures as rollback rights, only CalebChiam would be the one to remove them. TD5 has said that he doesn't mind me getting my rights back, and RaghavD said that he doesn't agree to me getting them back. CalebChiam said that if a majority of the admins and/or established users would allow me my rights back, then he would give them back. TD5 is fine with it, but RagdavD is not. The final desiscion is a tie breaker made by you. Can you please give me a second chance?. Please, give me another chance. If I screw up you can have me demoted again. If you give me another chance, I won't do anything to screw it up. EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 13:51, May 5, 2015 (UTC)

Supernatural Community Choice Awards - Season 10[]

Hey FTWinchester! I'm reaching out to see what you think about having a Wikia Awards on Supernatural Wiki since Season 10 is ending soon? We've done a few recently with communities like Glee Wiki and Narutopedia that were really popular and got a good response from the communities! I was thinking it might be fun to do something similar for Season 10 after it ends. Wikia Awards is kind of like the MTV Movie Awards where the community can vote on multiple categories for their favorite nominee! It would be great to get admin input on categories and nominees since you guys know all the details about the show and its characters. Check out those links above to see what Community Choice Awards look like and let me know if you're interested! Grace (profile)•(talk) 16:36, May 15, 2015 (UTC)

We were hoping to launch on the 21st to benefit off of the traffic coming in for the finale, but the dates could be flexible if you and the other admins are interested in making it big! We want maybe 8-10 categories though just to make it manageable :) Grace (profile)•(talk) 17:14, May 15, 2015 (UTC)

Great! Just let me know what the final decision is :D It would be great to do something with this community; I've noticed we haven't really done much programming with Supernatural in the past and it's a great show! Grace (profile)•(talk) 17:48, May 15, 2015 (UTC)

Hey, FTWinchester! Just checking in to see if you guys reached a yes or no decision yet :) Grace (profile)•(talk) 22:26, May 18, 2015 (UTC)
It's a great idea actually and I'm totally on board with this. Let me know what I can do. Like you, i've been out of touch with this season. TD5 or Empyrean (if he is made an admin) can help. Btw, is it just me or is the Wikia on the whole having problems? The connection times out and this is why I've been unable to reply before. RaghavD'"Look into my eyes. It’s where my demons hide" 17:51, May 19, 2015 (UTC)

Hey, FTWinchester! Just wanted to leave a note that RaghavD and I are moving forward with a Community Choice Award, so you'll be seeing something soon :) Any promotion help would be great! Grace (profile)•(talk) 15:45, May 22, 2015 (UTC)

Creating a poll[]

Hey, I would like to create a poll on something, when you have time, can you help me out? -- ImperiexSeed, 12:05 AM, May 16th 2015

Hi, Im really confused on how to add a main picturel You may have seen my edit to the alonso pic, I am just wondering on how to add a picture.

Many thanks,

TheUnstoppableShadow (talk) 22:41, May 27, 2015 (UTC)

A special thank you and goodbye![]

I'm leaving this wiki, but not cause of you. It was nice getting to work with you, and thanks for being my friend, you were great co-editor to work with. Goodbye mate! -- ImperiexSeed, 11:49 PM, May 27th 2015

Wiki Redesign[]

Staff member Grace mentioned that our Wiki's Main Page contains too many templates and offered to help redesign the Wiki. What do you say about that? RaghavD'"Look into my eyes. It’s where my demons hide" 14:37, June 1, 2015 (UTC)

Main page redesign[]

Hi FTWinchester! I'm Mark, from Wikia's Community Development Team. A while ago my colleague Grace contacted RaghavD about a main page redesign which is now done. I've presented it to RaghavD a few days ago, but he has yet to respond. As he might be away for a few days, I figured I'd contact you and see what you think of the design, and to see if you or any of the other admins have any feedback.

You can view the redesign on my test wikia. I'd love to hear what you think, and if you or any of the other admins would like to see anything changed.

Once you're happy with the design, let me know, and I'll put it live. Thanks! Mark (talk) 18:58, June 29, 2015 (UTC)

Never mind the above! RaghavD has responded. Mark (talk) 17:43, July 6, 2015 (UTC)

Admin Help[]

Didn't have time to post all the links. But, another edit war started. Seed and Trip both have left me messages about bias with Sam and Dean pages that Seed is doing. Please look at my talk page, and those pages history and get back to me. I'll be doing the same. So we can make a decision if any real action is needed. Thanks. [[User:Twilight Despair 5|]] ([[The God of Creation]]) (talk) 01:22, July 10, 2015 (UTC)

Hey FTW. As Twilight said, Imperiex is once again spreading his Sam hate across the wikia articles. We have already to told him to stop many times before this, and he just doesn't seem like he is going to quit. Since we have already given him plenty of warnings, and he refuses to stop spreading his bias across the articles, can you please give him a ban? Thanks. EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 01:29, July 10, 2015 (UTC)

Hello! We’re reaching out to a few of our top communities, hoping to get you on board with the migration to the new infobox markup.Our goal is to make content portable and more mobile friendly. We'd like your wikia to look good across all devices. Is this something you'd be interested in? If so, let me know and I can convert them for you. :)Witnessme (talk) 17:05, July 22, 2015 (UTC)

Hi again! Just wanted to check and see if you'd had a chance to look over the new infobox layout? Let me know what you think and if you'd like me to begin converting them into the new format.Witnessme (talk) 21:59, July 27, 2015 (UTC)

RE: Adminship[]

Thank you! I appreciate you watching quietly to see how I handled things, although I would have loved to hear what you had to say, because I respect your opinion. Yes, I definitely look to you when I think of an ideal user. A lot of what made me immature was my confrontational skills, biases, and use of symantics, which you really have a good hold on. I know I'll use my rights right this time, and want to thank you for your kind words and role modeling. EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 00:05, September 29, 2015 (UTC)

I saw your name on the talk page for Archangels, and I have a question. In the show, we have never seen a fight between leviathans and archangels or many other monsters, but for some reason, someone keeps adding their fan theory that Leviathans can beat every monster to numerous articles. While some people have tried to remove the theory from the pages, as the show's never discussed this, it keeps being added back in. EmpreyanSmoke then locked the pages for each archangel, and didn't take out the fan theory. If the show never showed us this information, should we just assume it is true because another fan thinks it is true? I thought pages should be written only with what we have actually seen in the show, or what the writers, cast, and whoever confirmed at cons and official Q and As?

If Leviathan can kill/eat archangels, which they can pretty easily, then by deduction, they can also easily kill any angel, any monster, any demon (except for maybe Knights), and any god (except God). Even Chet could push around Zeus like he's a spec of dust. lol -- ImperiexSeed, 10:19 PM, September 29th 2015

I see what you mean about monsters, I basically meant that the pagan deity pages and the archangel pages should not say they can be easily killed by Leviathans, as this was not clearly shown or stated on the show or at a con. Can you remove the statements from the Archangel page, and the pages for the four archangels because EmpreyanSmoke locked them so people can't remove it.

Season 11 Title Card[]

New Wiki main image if you're interested. I found it on reddit:


Can you please upgrade the background to the new title card? I have tried, but it will only filly up part of the screen. Thanks EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 02:23, October 10, 2015 (UTC)


Hey, FTW. Can you please comment on my new blog so we can finally reach a consensus? Thanks. EmpyreanSmoke (talk) 20:24, October 11, 2015 (UTC)

Battle section continuation[]

I'm sending this to you since you were the one who posted that big comment on the Battles Category Discussion page: I'm going to continue that thing a bit and post more battles and maybe edit the existing pages. I doubt I'll get them all, there's too many in the whole series for me to do that (10 SEASONS!!!, well... 9 thanks to you) but I'll do at least several more. I actually didn't know that section existed before last night or I would've done something earlier. I found it by accident while doing a search for the Attack Dog Spell to add from last night's episode and spotted the Attack on Bobby's House and Attack on the Holt's pages. I've written several battle pages on other wikis before: a few on the Stargate Wiki, all the Kane Chronicles battles (or at least nearly all before the merge to create the Riordan Wiki), several on Gears of War Wiki (where I hold the rank of Administrator by the way), several of the Falling Skies battles (I recently got into that show after seeing some of the last season) and several other wikis. I think I could do a good job of it. Feel free to edit though. If you want to respond, post to my own talk page please. I don't have an email linked to this site so I don't get notifications when things are updated. I'll keep an eye on my talk page though and I think a message appears at the top of the page when someone posts there anyway.--WarGrowlmon18 (talk) 19:08, October 22, 2015 (UTC)

  • Putting this here as I don't know if your watching my talk page so if you are, let me know when you respond so I can just post there. Anyway thank god your here!!! I had to put up a hell of a fight to keep that section going. The Admins wanted to shut it down. I managed to win the fight in the end as far as I can tell but I really could've used the backup. I mostly won by using the fact that you started that two years ago and they did nothing about it until I picked up where you left off. Far as I can tell I managed to save the section, but we need to keep an eye out for anyone trying that again. The discussion was on the discussion page for the Capture of Brady if you want to look at it and add in. Don't know why they didn't just do it under the discussion page for the battles, they did nothing with either of our comments there. Only reason I noticed was I happened to be working on that page when they started that discussion. That was a battle in itself.--WarGrowlmon18 (talk) 20:21, November 5, 2015 (UTC)
    • PS: I always liked the battle pages too and have always done my part in adding to them on other Wikis. Didn't know this Wiki had such a page or I would've done something much sooner. For example, if you know anything about the Kane Chronicles all the pages on the Rick Riordan Wiki (merged there since he did that and the Percy Jackson series) about the Kane Chronicles battles and the War With Apophis are all my work. I did some on other sites too including the Gears of War Wiki where I ended up becoming an Administrator.--WarGrowlmon18 (talk) 20:28, November 5, 2015 (UTC)

Again, can't tell if you are following my page (you didn't answer that like I asked) so here: I don't understand the last part of that comment about the x versus y thing, but yeah I agree about keeping those pages. I don't understand the problem some people were having with putting those pages on there. I'm gonna do a bit more work on that, but like I said before I don't intend to do the entire series, at least not right now, that's too much work at this point.--WarGrowlmon18 (talk) 21:57, November 6, 2015 (UTC)

I responded on my page and am not bothering to copy it here again. But would you please let me know if you are following my discussion page so that I don't keep having to do this??? You always seem to ignore that request as I still haven't gotten an answer from you about it.--WarGrowlmon18 (talk) 22:37, November 6, 2015 (UTC)


I am having problems with the user known as SeraphLucifer. He broke the three revert rule. He keeps adding non-cannon information. He keeps saying Archangels can kill knights of hell. He doesn't even say possibly, to imply they possibly can, yet leaving the possibility they can't. He is saying they can for certain even though we've never seen a knight of hell be killed by anything but the 1st blade. I've repeatedly warned him to stop and put my reasoning for it . He refuses and just undoes my edits without argument whatsoever. His only argument, was something along the lines of "In the lore it says the archangels could kill them."

There are two major problems with this argument.  The first being: the lore greatly differs from the show. For example Lucifer is a Cherub in the lore and Michael is a seraph. Yet, in the show, both are archangels. This is just one of many differences.

Number 2: Even if we do give him the benefit of the doubt.  The Knights were created by the writers purely for plot. Their is absolutely no lore on The Knights whatsoever. So that's obviously a lie.

Please ban him as it is corrupting the wikia. Thank you. 22:25, November 12, 2015 (UTC)

  • Agreed. The guy keeps adding Holy White Light to the Gadreel page even though it was long ago agreed that that was just an effect of him showing his wings.--WarGrowlmon18 (talk) 04:23, November 14, 2015 (UTC)

Re:Policy enforcement[]

Hey, could you link me to the IP users and the specific edits you're referring to? Calebchiam Talk 01:03, November 13, 2015 (UTC)

Re: Darkness + First Evil[]

I noticed your edit on the Darkness page. I take it you are also a buffy fan? FTWinchester (talk) 13:21, November 5, 2015 (UTC)

Yes I am. I grew up watching Buffy and the Darkness reminded me of the First Evil. At least the Darkness on this show can physically do more against people unlike the First. Ber246 (talk) 06:00, November 18, 2015 (UTC)

EmpyreanSmoke Ban[]

Hello, I would appreciate to hear your thoughts regarding --Lambda1 (talk) 20:42, December 7, 2015 (UTC)

Barricading Spell[]

Hey FTWinchester, I realized that there are 2 pages related (barricading and restricting spell), can you delete one of them? SeraphLucifer (talk) 01:46, January 8, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Firstly, apologize I always forget to sign it... Secondly I think restricting spell page looks better and detailed. SeraphLucifer (talk) 01:46, January 8, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

That would be better than deleting. :D SeraphLucifer (talk) 01:50, January 8, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Re: Main Page[]

Thanks FTWinchester. What I've done is just a fraction of what you've done for the WIki. :) RaghavD'"Look into my eyes. It’s where my demons hide" 02:08, January 20, 2016 (UTC)

Hope we can improve the Wiki and make it worth a reader's time. RaghavD'"Look into my eyes. It’s where my demons hide" 16:39, January 21, 2016 (UTC)


Hi FTWinchester, I am doing sort of a survey, I just want to learn your opinions about my edits, if you could reply I'd be grateful. SeraphLucifer (talk) 18:02, January 25, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Bot request[]

Hello. I'm a bureaucrat at the Ben 10 wiki, and I'm here to help this wiki become as good as the series. I'll be editing a lot during the next few weeks, and I'd like to know if the admins here would approve of my request for a bot. Although a bot requires community approval, and not just admin approval, I think it proper to ask you guys first. I already use a bot on the Ben 10 wiki, and you can check my work there if you'd like.

Orion (T-B-C) 22:10, January 25, 2016 (UTC)

Hi. I got your message. To answer your question, I have watched other shows shows of the Supernatural genre, such as Buffy, Charmed, and Angel. While I initially enjoyed the ideas they had, they unfortunately followed the same track where they tried to enact ideas to make the shows more interesting but from a writing standpoint, the ideas in later seasons collapsed on themselves.

DragonWarrior627 (talk) 16:56, January 27, 2016 (UTC)DragonWarrior627DragonWarrior627 (talk) 16:56, January 27, 2016 (UTC)

Re:Wikia mobile app[]

I'm not surprised about the lack of editing support, since it's much the same for other Wikis, and the app was more or less envisioned as an easier way to browse Wikis as opposed to maintain them. You could trying asking around on - I don't have anyone in particular to point you to, I'm afraid. Cheers. Calebchiam Talk 04:11, January 30, 2016 (UTC)

Re:Unorganised templates[]

Hey, the templates you mentioned are actually fundamental to the functioning of several higher-level templates. The documentation is unfortunately lacking as you pointed out, and the details of how they work have long escaped me. You can use Special:Whatlinkshere to see where a template is being used, in order to evaluate whether or not to delete it though. Cheers. Calebchiam Talk 13:37, January 31, 2016 (UTC)

Re: Wiki clean up[]

I am now. So have you been looking into the Insights page too? The only thing I managed to do was to ensure there were no uncategorised pages. That's how far I got. Also, I have been meaning to ask someone about the Pages without an Infobox. Some articles (like the Angel Blades one) do have an infobox but are being listed on this page. Guess our infobox is not a standard or a recognized one.  RaghavD"I'm a CLASSIC man" 14:16, January 31, 2016 (UTC)

I not sure how I feel about new admins. We have had bad experiences with two of them and I seriously don't think I can trust anyone else. That being said, what do we do about Thepsychofroggy's ban? Should we extend Imperiex's ban too? Caleb did ban two of Empyrean's IP addresses for evading his ban, but that did not stop him from leaving comments. RaghavD"I'm a CLASSIC man" 16:06, January 31, 2016 (UTC)

Speculation on the wiki[]

I gotta ask, what exactly is your (admins') justification for allowing unconfirmed information on the basis that "it's possible"? A writer can change literally anything in a series, from God being the second (maybe third) being in existence to Reapers being Angels, and they always have more in mind than what we know. When I look at all the fan speculation - which it is; it's just flimsy rationalizations at best - the only thing that comes to mind is that this seems more like a fan fiction wiki than a canon one. I'm not the only one who thinks so, by the way.

A while back I inquired about this, and the admin I spoke to said that as long as something wasn't outright contradicted in the series, and had some justification, we could put it in articles. That's not how it works. I could come up with a dozen theories of my own that weren't contradicted in the series, had some justification, and not only aren't true, but are downright bizarre or irrelevant. For example (and yes, I made these up on the spot):

  • Azazel was once a human who died of liver issues. This explains the yellow coloration of his eyes (jaundice).
  • Dick Roman doesn't actually like the taste of human flesh as much as other Leviathan. This explains why he's never actually seen eating a human in the series (just other Leviathan) and why he likes his meals prepared (to improve the taste).
  • Ruby and Meg are actually the same demon. After Lucifer got out of his cage, he brought her back. Remember how she said "These are the days of miracle and wonder, Dean. Our father is among us (...)"? This explains why they're never seen together and why Meg was tortured in Hell, despite her loyalty to Azazel (indicating the other demons didn't know about that, just like they didn't know about Ruby's loyalty).

These aren't contradicted in the series, and yet, they're still wrong or downright irrelevant. Azazel dying of liver issues is irrelevant (though probably correct, if he's as old as the series implied), all Leviathan crave human flesh, and Ruby and Meg are definitely different demons. However, under the current system you have, they could all be added, and the only justification you (admins) could come up with that didn't involve what other wikis do - none of it is confirmed - is that you (admins), personally, didn't agree with my theories.

I ask you to change this; do what every other wiki does - unless something is said to be true, assume it is false - and start removing all the fan speculation. Supernatural is probably the best TV series at the moment. This wiki should be a reflection of that quality, and not a place for every Tom, Dick, and Harry to put what they think in the (supposedly canon) articles. They are not the writers.

Orion (T-B-C) 07:29, February 7, 2016 (UTC)

Hello FTWinchester and Orion, I left a response to both of you on the reaper talk page and also regarding speculation, Caleb commented on this a few months back. Speculation is only allowed on blogs and user pages You can find that info here Bkshadows (talk)

To be clear, I was told "intuitive leaps" were allowed. However, to me, the moment one says something not in a series - no matter how much sense it might make, or how much "circumstantial evidence", if you will, there is - one is speculating.
Orion (T-B-C) 23:26, February 7, 2016 (UTC)
Am I correct in assuming that saying a weapon might possibly harm a creature is also considered speculation?
Orion (T-B-C) 20:17, February 27, 2016 (UTC)


This user keeps inserting false information into Dean's article.

Orion (T-B-C) 20:02, February 21, 2016 (UTC)


Although some of this user's edits are beneficial, most are him adding his fan fiction (presumably for the same reasons as the user a while back who posted blogs of his fan fiction characters) and subsequently removing it. He's done this on other wikis as well.

Orion (T-B-C) 15:31, February 28, 2016 (UTC)

Can you ban this user?[]

Hey FTW, I hope you are okay. Can you please ban that user? He is corrupting the wikia.

SeraphLucifer (talk) 21:38, March 15, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

RE: Ban request[]

For the record, I don't request bans. I report users and leave it up to the admins' judgement, as I expect it to be done on my home wiki. As for the Emboar comment, let's just say you and I are enemies now.

Orion (T-B-C) 21:54, March 15, 2016 (UTC)


Haven't seen you active in awhile man, hope all is well. Anyway when you find the time I was hoping you could go over the Lucifer first son blog and give me your thoughts on the matter. Do you YOURSELF believe this is a retcon? should all the articles be rewritten to suddenly accommodate this? Does one statement from one character negate the countless others we've heard over the years including from Michael himself? Should we WAIT until we hear more on this subject? My stands was to leave everything as is, add Amaras view point to the trivia, and leave it at that. This was done on the Supernatural Super Wiki. Twilight simply locked the pages with it stating Lucifer is now the first archangel but I'm curious to hear some more rational thoughts on this matter. Also I was made aware you found some proof about the angels and reapers retcon? Could you point me in the direction of that? I've been searching for years and would simply add it to the trivia section. Bkshadows (talk)

Please Help[]

Hi, I don't know if you're still on, but if you are, can you please ban Noahaquarius23? He keeps altering the Witch page and constantly puts false info and redirect links in, and constantly redoes this every time it's undone. He refuses to listen or even argue, as he has said absolutely nothing on the matter whatsoever. So can you please help and ban this incredibly annoying user? Gabriel456 (talk) 18:24, April 25, 2016 (UTC)

Thanks for responding. Twilight had already blocked him, but only for a week (I think this Tuesday or Wednesday is when the block ends, so bracing myself...)

Anyways, the specific false info that I know of is the fact that he kept messing with the classifications without valid confirmation. i.e, removing the unknown classifications and putting them in the others, such as naturals and borrowers, even though it was never stated, such as Maggie and Don Stark. They're witches, yes, but it was never shown nor referred to in the episode that they got their power from demons like previous witches. Putting them in the naturals is also speculation because it was never stated, especially with the fact that the concept of those things didn't even exist until S10...

but I'm rambling/ranting. I'm trying to link to the edit change, but for some reason, the wiki is reading it as a uncreated page... Gabriel456 (talk) 17:05, May 1, 2016 (UTC)

Thank you for responding, and thanks for listening. Sorry again for the rant, Noah really got on my nerves :p. The help is really appreciated 15:38, May 3, 2016 (UTC)Gabriel456 (talk)

Fan fiction article[]

Syguy2013 created Fan Fictions|an article for fan fiction. On my home wiki, prior to my joining it, the admins tried to balance canon and fanon on the same wiki, using categories and templates that let users know what was canon and what was fanon. However, it didn't work. Fanon spilled out onto canon articles, and the wiki was left a mess. It took months to clean it up afterward, and even now, years later, we're still finding fanon on a few articles. I recommend you delete this article.

Orion (T-B-C) 09:52, May 4, 2016 (UTC)

I haven't even played X/Y, and, from what I heard, OR/AS were terrible remakes, so I haven't been checking up on the newer generations.

Orion (T-B-C) 11:42, May 12, 2016 (UTC)


Hey! So, I don't know if you have already heard, but a new show called "Guilt" on Freeform will be premiering on Monday June 13, 2016 at 9/8c! Here is a little description of Guilt as well as the promo (here) if you care to take a look:


“Guilt” is an edgy, soapy thriller that revolves around an American in London who becomes the prime suspect in the savage murder of her roommate. As the investigation unfolds, the viewers will question whether she's a naive, young girl whose poor decisions are being magnified under the ruthless glare of the British tabloids, or whether she's a sociopath who brutally murdered her friend.

Anyway, in the spirit of this new series(which has been renewed for a full first season!), I have created a Guilt Wiki! It currently has all the up to date information on the series and all of the confirmed episodes and characters, even locations <3 ;)

We are also looking for new admins to join the team so if you're interested, please let me know and I can add you! And we are also looking for just new contributors to help out and grow the wiki!

Thanks and hope to see you there!

P.S. Could you possibly affiliate with us on any of the wikis you admin (i.e. Supernatural,etc), that would be a great help if at all possible!

Audreytalk 05:05, May 5, 2016 (UTC)

Reapers as Angels[]

Hey FTW, I decided to bring this topic up again. I want to learn your opinions about them and if you agree with me that reapers are not being angels, your help would be nice. SeraphLucifer (talk) 15:47, May 16, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Well, I am checking the evidences, they are not really angels actually. Angels of Death is the most fitting term for them but it is obvious that they are another species besides angels. Yes, Dean referred Tessa as an angel but I don't think in he really meant she was a celestial being. I have to work hard on this one. What do you think about Zachariah tho? He was stated as a Seraph for long but I found 0 sources that confirms he is a Seraph. SeraphLucifer (talk) 18:10, May 16, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Television footer[]

Hi, FTWinchester!

Would you be interested in having Supernatural included in our television footer program?

Best regards,

Raylan13 (talk) 19:12, May 20, 2016 (UTC)

Rarely, a site can be placed in multiple footers, and then a site will typically choose one to host on their main page (just to avoid clutter). Supernatural is definitely one of those shows that sits on the perfect edge of multiple genres. I'll place it in the Horror and Fantasy footers; whichever you decide is the best fit for the main page, let me know! Raylan13 (talk) 14:58, May 21, 2016 (UTC)
A wiki Vandal:
Twilight told me to message all of the Admins, I simple don't have time. You logged in most recently, thought I'd just message you. Also, I hope you'll support the idea of restricting editing to registered/logged-in users. Zane T 69 (talk) 02:18, June 12, 2016 (UTC)
This: user has been vandalizing, putting false info in articles and edit warring.Zane T 69 (talk) 18:45, June 19, 2016 (UTC)
Is my application okay? I had them linked to the application, I thought people created a subpage like a sandbox and then created the application. Can I put the application link back in beside my username?Zane T 69 (talk) 23:02, June 19, 2016 (UTC)
Okay. You should consider being B-crat. I looked, and Caleb hasn't been active on the RS wikis either. Zane T 69 (talk) 17:47, June 25, 2016 (UTC)

"Unknown" category[]

Hey, do you think we should create an "unknown" category, for characters whose status are currently unknown (Lucifer, Sam, Inias, Joshua)? Kajune (talk) 17:37, June 21, 2016 (UTC)

This user has vandalized the "God" page extensively, a newer user reverted it. I just thought the vandal should be punished. Here's the pages edit history: Zane T 69 (talk) 16:50, June 25, 2016 (UTC)


Understood. SeraphLucifer (talk) 19:38, June 25, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Re:Bureaucracy + RfA[]

Hey FTWinchester, thanks for the message. Hope you're doing well too, it's been a while. Regarding the RfA, as stated on Supernatural Wiki:Requests for adminship, nominations run for two weeks before being closed. Appreciate the heads-up, I'll close it on 3 Jul. In the meantime, it would be great if the other active users would give their input for the RfA. I have some concerns about the newness of the candidate, but if the rest of the community is willing to back him, I'll be happy to sysop him. Cheers. Calebchiam Talk 02:04, June 26, 2016 (UTC)


Hey FTW, I just want to say that even this season, its been proven that Reapers are not angels. Why do wikia keep listing them as angels? SeraphLucifer (talk) 12:24, June 26, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

The Inner Hate[]

This user keeps inserting unconfirmed/unsourced information into a character's article.

Orion (T-B-C) 23:48, June 26, 2016 (UTC)

It's one of the reasons, yes. Everything can be summarized by what my profile says: I'm here to help this wiki be as good as the series. No more, no less.

I have no desire for adminship. I have no need for it either. If I wanted it, I'd write an application and get it (I know of no user who would oppose, given my experience with adminship and edit record here, so it'd most likely be approved by unanimous vote).

What you must understand is that I'm not here to be a part of this community. I abstain from the vast majority of issues because of that. When I think something lowers the quality of this wiki, then I speak my mind. Otherwise, I leave it up to you guys.

Furthermore, were I to be promoted to admin, there would be changes that not everyone would be happy with, both due to the way I'd be doing them (without consulting the users before making those changes), and from the changes themselves (I'd be making them on my own, so they'd be based on my vision for the wiki, which would inevitably conflict with other users'). I assume my adminship would be short-lived under those conditions.

Orion (T-B-C) 21:42, June 28, 2016 (UTC)

This user blantantly vandalized a page, thought i'd inform you so you can block/warn whatever is appropriate.Zane T 69 (talk) 01:55, June 29, 2016 (UTC)

Maybe I have been a bit harsh. But some of these people I have blocked for a week or month for minor problems. And they come back doing it again. I'll lessen the block times from now on.[[User:Twilight Despair 5|]] ([[The God of Creation]]) (talk) 22:51, July 2, 2016 (UTC)

Off the top of my head, I can't really think of any other users who's opinion is respected. I'l just let other users weigh in as they desire. When the RFA ends, when will I be promoted? If I have enough support. Zane T 69 (talk) 23:06, July 2, 2016 (UTC)

First issue.[]

I discovered I can't edit the "on the wiki" tab, and post a list of staff, a place to report and add a link to the policies. So I propose the creation of a page called the Admin Noticeboard which we can create links too, at the top of our talkpages. Its not my first choice, but it'll work. Opinions? Zane T 69 (talk) 03:53, July 3, 2016 (UTC)

I gave up on putting it in header/wiki navigation. According to an extremely knowledgeable friend its impossible. I did create an admin noticeboard, though. EDIT: whats the policy on pictures uploaded just for user pages? I saw Caleb say they were forbidden, but he never deleted them, like he said he would. Zane T 69 (talk) 18:25, July 3, 2016 (UTC)

here Zane T 69 (talk) 22:01, July 3, 2016 (UTC)

Personally, I feel that Calebs intent was clear, but i'l wait till I hear back from him. I will try proving my point, though. "stop uploading any more pictures that are not meant for use on Supernatural articles. The Wiki is not your personal hosting space." He even said he'll delete them another day. But i'l wait till Caleb confirms it. Zane T 69 (talk) 22:24, July 3, 2016 (UTC)

Are these photos: :File:301113 423967634318211 1672839788 n.jpg|one :File:427825 241292179326597 1802982085 n.jpg|two :File:1x15VaginaTransplant.jpg|three :File:394245 504953749533794 645295846 n.jpg|four grounds for banning? Separate or together?Zane T 69 (talk) 16:47, July 4, 2016 (UTC)

I gave him a month, and stipulated that it can be reduced or added too, by senior admins/bcrats, due to my new admin status. Or if you want, I can add more time too it. I allowed him to edit his own talk/user page for appeal reasons. Zane T 69 (talk) 16:59, July 4, 2016 (UTC)

Should i leave the photos on wiki, for evidence, or will us as witnesses be enough? Zane T 69 (talk) 17:03, July 4, 2016 (UTC)

I'l probably leave them as unaltered evidence, since i'm new, my word means less. And I went back and fixed that. Thank you, for pointing that out. Zane T 69 (talk) 17:09, July 4, 2016 (UTC)

How do rollbacks get promoted/elected? I noticed a serious deficit with them. Zane T 69 (talk) 20:16, July 16, 2016 (UTC)

Hey. Was wondering if you'll give your opinion on this, when you get a chance.Zane T 69 (talk) 20:14, September 16, 2016 (UTC)

No problem. I wanted the issue to get plenty of attention, so we can get consensus.Zane T 69 (talk) 00:13, September 25, 2016 (UTC)

I was wondering if you can give your opinion on this. Zane T 69 (talk) 17:20, September 26, 2016 (UTC)


Thanks a lot FTW, looking forward to work with you too. Currently I have a broken arm so I am kinda inactive. SeraphLucifer (talk) 07:38, July 9, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

New Pages[]

Hey, I just wanted to apologize, I think I should, for stuffing the wikia with a bunch of "minor character" pages. XD I keep thinking I overdid it. I'll be taking a break for now too. Just letting you know. Kajune (talk) 08:01, July 11, 2016 (UTC) 

Wiki Navigation[]

Hey FTW, made some changes about wiki navigation, do you think it is okay? SeraphLucifer (talk) 17:06, July 15, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

In order to create community section, I had to merge characters and eras under one category. SeraphLucifer (talk) 15:28, July 17, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Re:Reapers are Angels[]

That topic does suck. Lots of plot holes... I don't know what to do about it. Here's what I can say about this topic:

It has been already stated in Season 1 that Reapers are angels of Death. However, their true form and abilities were diferent from angels besides it has been stated by Castiel that angels weren't roaming Earth about 2000 years. In that case the book meant that Reapers aren't angels, messengers of Death. Reapers do not require vessels to physically exist on Earth and their true form is skeleton like. Dean was able to see it, humans don't have ability to see angels in their true form. That simply emphasizes that Reapers are no angels. Lets move onward.

Apocalypse came and past.  As we see in Season 6 and 7 Reapers were continuing their jobs as usual but however in Season 8 and 9, we witnessed that Reapers could go rogue. As Balthazar stated: "It's a new era. No rules, no destiny. Just utter and complete freedom".  Also angel blades were effective on Reapers. Angel blades can kill celestial and demonic beings infact even hellhounds. That still does not prove that Reapers are angels. Season 9 is the place where everything changes. I'll write a the dialogue between Bartholomew and Maurice:

B: The issue is, he somehow managed to ward himself against us. Our ability to track him has been jammed, which brings us to you.

M: My kind, we always get what we're looking for, chief.

B: Yes, reapers. But some of you have taken your skill set to a whole new level...

M: That's the rumor.

B: ...and are willing to freelance. For a price. That's the rumor.

M: Jump start me. How do I start looking for this... Castiel?

B: I got one word for you. Winchester.

In that case Reapers and Angels are certainly different species. "My kind and yours". Later on Castiel is taken hostage by a Reaper who possessed April Kelly. Demons, Leviathans, Angels even Khan Worms can possess humans. That still does not prove that Reapers are angels. No need to write the dialogue between her and Castiel. Lets get to most important part. Episode. Stairway to Heaven.

When Dean was interrogating Flagstaff, he heard Tessa's name and asked: "Tessa? The Reaper Tessa? After on we learned that Tessa was also working with Castiel. Now there is the game changing quote: 

D: Good times. Here's the deal. I like you Tess, okay? For an angel. But tell me, why are you doing this? 

T: Castiel.

D: No, forget Cas. Why are you doing this? What would make a person want to pop their top, huh? I mean, look, I've been in bad shape. I have. But I have never been that damn low.

T: I guess I just can't take the screaming.

D: Who's screaming?

T: All of them. The lost souls. The ones that can't get into heaven now that it's been boarded up. I hear them. They are so confursed. They're in so much pain. All I want to do is help them. It's what I do. It's my job. But I can't. So I suffered... Until death, nothingness. Suddenly it didn't seem so bad. It seemed quiet.

D: So, why don't you just jam an angel blade in your throat and call it a day?

T: I thought about it. But I was too weak. Till Castiel gave me reason to die.

Now as we see, Dean referred the Reaper Tessa as angel. Tessa was able to use the suicide sigil just like Oren and Constantine. As I understood Tessa, a Reaper, joined Castiel' s legion to defeat Metatron and restore the order (Not mentioning brain washing). So that the souls can be transferred to Heaven once again. This is all about Reapers purpose but, Tessa being able to use suicide sigil does not make sense if she is not an angel. Dean's referrence might be literal or he was meaning something else like about angels around them. Angels are supposed to serve God, Reapers are supposed to serve Death. I don't know if he meant angel as species or servants type of meaning. Besides this line, we already saw that Reapers and Angels are completely different beings. Lets catch up with the Season 11.

After banishing angels from Heaven, all of angels wings were burnt or got broken. The nnes who were already fallen angels like the Grigori and Lucifer, kept their wings since they were still able to teleport and Lucifer was even able to time travel. However a Reaper, Billie was able to teleport differently then angels. The spell was supposed to affect all present angels. That shows that still Angels and Reapers are seperated beings. For last, in 11x23 when God, Cas, Crowley, Rowena, Sam and Dean were in the bunker, Billie came to talk with Winchesters. After their failure to obtain souls from angels, Billie said that: If you need souls, call a Reaper. That also seperates Angels and Reapers like Bart and Maurice's talk. 

In conclusion, we have much more evidence that Reapers aren't angels but still episode 9x22 confuses me. And of course some other uncertain clues. That's all I can write for this topic. Didn't decide to what do about Reapers on the wiki. Thanks for reading. Please tell me your decision. SeraphLucifer (talk) 12:18, August 14, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Greetings from Vanguard: Portable Infoboxes[]

Hey, FTWinchester!

I noticed you are one of the active admins on the Supernatural Wiki, so I'm leaving this message to notify you of Fandom's portability efforts and how Vanguard can help improve your wiki. :)

Please see my blog post here if you are interested in improving your community's infoboxes - User blog:Monochromatic Bunny/Greetings from Vanguard: Portable Infoboxes.

Thanks! —Monochromatic Bunny | 18:46, September 30, 2016 (UTC)


Hi! What episode and season does this GIF belong to?

IMG 8316.gif

—Preceding unsigned comment added by Bella Thorne 01 (talkcontribs)


I created a page for the Implosion power since its been used so much now. I think we should include the Darkness killing that angel in 11x10, the one where she waved her hand and he exploded. We have that listed as a Smiting but that looked more like what Lucifer did to Jofiel with a different hand waving motion. With the explosion and the light left behind instead of blood and gore.--WarGrowlmon18 (talk) 15:56, October 17, 2016 (UTC)

Help Required[]

Hey FTW, I wonder if you can help us on something. As you know new season started and we need some updates through the wiki. SeraphLucifer (talk) 14:15, November 1, 2016 (UTC)SeraphLucifer


Then maybe the others could be renamed Molecular Combustion??? I think that fits as well. Especially since Cas told Claire he was ripped apart on a subatomic level when explaining Jimmy's death to her. That could be Molecular Combustion. Just with more flashy effects than Piper's version of the power.--WarGrowlmon18 (talk) 17:20, November 10, 2016 (UTC)

What do you think??? If you agree, I'll separate the page into Implosion and Molecular Combustion.--WarGrowlmon18 (talk) 18:21, November 13, 2016 (UTC)

I think you misunderstood: what I said to Zane was you hadn't replied to my replies to your messages yet. Which is true: you didn't until tonight. I would like to ask that you do something about the size of the video/image thing on the implosion page because its far too big and neither Zane nor I know how to fix that. I copied it over from the Metatron page but the size isn't really that good for the implosion page.--WarGrowlmon18 (talk) 03:30, November 15, 2016 (UTC)

Thanks. That sounds really complicated though and I don't really intend to have a need to do something like that again but thanks for the info and the help.--WarGrowlmon18 (talk) 05:05, November 16, 2016 (UTC)

Saw your message on TD5's wall. The Rollback was left over, he even retained the rights while banned. Zane T 69 (talk) 15:45, December 8, 2016 (UTC)

To my knowledge only bureaucrats can take or give any kind of Admin or Rollback rights. My admin powers are, deleting, locking, pages and blocking and unblocking users. Also I honestly don't remember unblocking him. I thought his block just expired but I have blocked a lot of people so I can't keep track of them all. I'll trust the backup logs of course if it said that I did unblock him. Is he causing problems?[[User:Twilight Despair 5|]] ([[The God of Creation]]) (talk) 02:00, December 9, 2016 (UTC)


Hey FTWinchester, it's been a while. I'm doing good - Cornell University's Early Decision results just came out today and I was accepted as an international applicant, so that's something exciting to look forward to after the Air Force. Hope all is well with you too.

Anyway, to answer your question, yes, the status was left in when I desysopped him. It wasn't something that was explicitly mentioned during the desysop discussion, so there's no community consensus on it either way. I didn't consciously leave it in, but even now, I don't think there's any harm in him having it. Between admin tools and rollback, the latter is relatively harmless as long as an administrator is around. And to my knowledge, despite being involved in edit wars, he hasn't actually misused rollback tool to undo an opposing user's edits - so I'd say the point is moot.

Finally, he was desysopped for abusing the trust of the community and spreading false information. That being said, despite some concerns raised about his judgement as an administrator in specific instances, there wasn't any malicious use of rollback (or admin tools, arguably) during his time as an editor. Given that, I'd say there's no harm in letting him hold onto rollback and even now, I'd trust him to use it to quick-revert any vandalism he comes across. Besides, even if they were removed a year ago, should he request them now while citing his past year of good behaviour, there would be little reason for me to withhold them from him as well.

If you have any issues with this, feel free to raise them and we can discuss further. By the way, he wasn't unblocked - according to his log, his block expired in Feb 16 like it was supposed to. Cheers. Calebchiam Talk 10:52, December 9, 2016 (UTC)

Maurice (Vampire) does not have an image of the character[]

Dear FTWinchesters,

One of my favorite pages on this wiki is the Maurice (Vampire) page and it doesn't have an image of the character. That is very bothersome to me and I was hoping you could find an image of the character from the show and put on the page. I would be very grateful and it would make the page so much cooler. Its all right if you don't want to I'll understand. If you do try please put a good picture please. 03:51, January 14, 2017 (UTC)Ryan Cruz

The matter has been brought to my attention, and the page creator may still put one the page. He is simply having technological difficulties. Zane T 69 (talk) 04:01, January 14, 2017 (UTC)

Hey, FTW. Seraph and I are gathering the admins to discuss an infinite ban of ImperiexSeed. Sadly, but not surprising, he hasn't changed at all. Please let me know when a good time is, or just contact me on my wall to give your opinion. Zane T 69 (talk) 15:32, February 16, 2017 (UTC)


I noticed your edit to the Princes of Hell page and assume your back. I'm currently trying to become an Admin myself and would appreciate your support if your willing to give it to me.--WarGrowlmon18 (talk) 03:32, February 24, 2017 (UTC)

Hey, I looked into Orphaned Pages. How do I start reducing the number of them. It said: "The following pages are not linked from or transcluded into other pages in Supernatural Wiki." I checked one page, and it had links to other pages. Does it need links going to the pages, also? Zane T 69 (talk) 19:10, March 1, 2017 (UTC)

Okay, I linked Ben Collins to this orphaned page, but when I refreshed, it still showed it was orphaned. Does it take time to update the list of orphaned pages, after you alter one? Zane T 69 (talk) 22:36, March 1, 2017 (UTC)

Thanks, hope you have a good shift. Zane T 69 (talk) 22:48, March 1, 2017 (UTC)

Just thought I'd give you an update. I did quite a few pages, atleast over 50% I think. Once it refreshes the list I'll go back over it, and see what else I can do. I'll suggest this work to a couple other more knowledgeable users too. Zane T 69 (talk) 00:16, March 2, 2017 (UTC)

Can I get your opinion on this? It's the new season infobox recently created. Zane T 69 (talk) 02:45, March 2, 2017 (UTC)

Re: Ruler of Hell edit[]

The exact line you cited of Crowley's mention of Lilith goes as "Well, with Lilith and Azazel dead and Lucifer back in his box, we need a ruler. You're next in line, Ramiel, Prince of Hell." Now as you see the context of it does not specifically state that "Lilith and" the Princes of Hell are heirs to Lucifer's throne as you inferred, only that with Lilith and Azazel's deaths that Ramiel was next in line to succeed Lucifer after "Swan Song". I will not disagree his wording did imply Lilith was at the top of Hell's line of succession, but with Azazel dead and the other Princes uninterested in both the war and the throne, it can also be assumed she just took charge under the circumstances being the highest-ranking demon left and/or because of her role in freeing Lucifer. In addition, when Crowley and Castiel explain who Ramiel is to Mary, Sam, and Dean later in the episode, the only mention of Lilith is just that the Princes were the first generation of demons after her, not that she preceded them as heirs nor that she was one herself. To continue, I assuming you know Eric Kripke had previously stated in interview that Lilith was much higher in Hell's hierarchy than Azazel to the point to where she would be right beneath Lucifer himself, but t with the establishment of Princes of Hell that seems to call into question Kripke's statement as obviously with Azazel "now" being a Prince, he would presumably be directly behind Lilith, or even ahead of her in the demon ranks. Also, as Dagon was able to kill two angels with her "bare hands", whereas Lilith and Alistair have only been known or seen to either overpower or torture angels, we can now assume Yellow-Eyed-Demons are on par, if not surpass White-Eyed Demons. I am just have a sense this episode had retconned Azazel's position which has partially skewed the extent of how Lilith is supposed to be as a higher-ranked and more dangerous/powerful demon than him. In conclusion, my point is Crowley mentioning Lilith may implied she was an heir along with the Princes, but nonetheless its speculative as is the assumption I provided above and as you know we try to refrain from adding speculation to the wiki's pages. I hope I explained my point clear enough. Sorry, if it's a little lengthy. 21:33, February 27, 2017 (UTC)

Suffice to say, the reason I removed Lilith from the page is because the line you speak of is being taken out of context. As Crowley said "Well, with Lilith and Azazel dead, and Lucifer back in his box, we need a ruler. You are next in line, Ramiel. Prince of Hell", nor later in the episode "The oldest of the old demons. The first generation after Lilith. Lucifer turned them himself before the oceans drank Atlantis," and as Cass also says " They were trained to be generals in demonic armies in the war against Heaven", but nowhere is it specifically stated Lilith was an heir to Lucifer's throne, only that it can be inferred the Princes are with the establishment of Ramiel being next in line with the aforementioned either dead or reimprisoned. To clarify, I am not disputing Lilith's position in Hell's hierarchy, but the purpose of my previous post was to elaborate how as of "Stuck in the Middle (With You)" it is no longer a certainty that she is as high up on the food chain as once thought with the introduction of the Knights of Hell and Princes of Hell between S8-S12, if not also whether her being Lucifer's long-supposed second-in-command will be left unchanged. You are correct Lilith being mentioned before Azazel should not be seen as an afterthought, but that is as an acknowledgement that as the First Demon, there was no demon ranked higher (nor more feared) than her which had already been known prior to the episode. This is how the line is taken out context as the page states "in the absence of Lucifer, Lilith and the Princes of Hell are next in line for the throne of Hell," but the dialogue we both have quoted from the episode is actually implying, if not outright establishing that as the generals to "Lucifer's" demonic armies, the Princes immediately follow Lilith (again, who's position in Hell's hierarchy has already been stated in the past) as heirs to his throne. While I will admit the removal of Lilith was probably not the best choice, I do feel the wording needs to be changed for better accuracy which I have taken the liberty to do so myself. If you disagree with my changes, feel free to undo my edit, but I would like to hear as to why. 06:46, March 1, 2017 (UTC)

Hey, FTW. I created a forum to discuss and vote on the Seasons Infobox. Link. I, along with a few other users, worked on the orphaned pages too, but we seem to be unable to clean up the rest. Touchinos also updated the listing of ratings too. Zane T 69 (talk) 15:16, April 2, 2017 (UTC)

Can you direct your attention to this matter? Zane T 69 (talk) 20:44, June 17, 2017 (UTC)

Season 13 Title Card for the main page:



Hey FTW, hope you are doing fine... Can we gather all active admins, I'd like to speak about something. SeraphLucifer (talk) 20:25, November 4, 2017 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Also, when you are avaiable, can I ask you something non-related with the Wiki? SeraphLucifer (talk) 20:38, November 4, 2017 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Alright. I guess we have 8 hours of time difference between our locations (I live in Middle East). I'll be avaiable this weekend so write me anytime you want. SeraphLucifer (talk) 16:43, November 9, 2017 (UTC)SeraphLucifer

Re: Battles[]

Thanks. I'm currently working on one right now in my sandbox. Should be up in awhile. That'll actually make exactly 100 battle pages, most of which are mine.--WarGrowlmon18 (talk) 20:05, December 9, 2017 (UTC)

No prob, I enjoy it. And yeah, its shocking in retrospect that some members wanted them deleted towards the beginning. Oh well, we won that particular fight. I've come a long way since then too, being an Admin myself now.--WarGrowlmon18 (talk) 20:10, December 9, 2017 (UTC)

Thanks man, I appreciate that.--WarGrowlmon18 (talk) 20:16, December 9, 2017 (UTC)

can I copy your message box at the top for my page?[]

can I copy your message box at the top for my page, I realy like it and it gets the point across well. ThomasNealy (talk) 20:29, December 9, 2017 (UTC)

thanks!ThomasNealy (talk) 20:37, December 9, 2017 (UTC)

I really like the boxes.  Before I saw yours I did not know how to do it.  I hope you don't mind but I gave you credit on it.  If you want me to remove your name let me know. ThomasNealy (talk) 20:55, December 9, 2017 (UTC)

Forum talk[]

There is a discussion occurring on how we should format the Season pages and the episode summaries. Please join the discussion.Click here --ThomasNealy (talk) 05:05, December 14, 2017 (UTC)

Hey, FTW. I've finally been nominated for B-Crat and would like your support. Link. Zane T 69 (talk) 00:01, December 23, 2017 (UTC)

New staff nominations.[]

Dtol has been nominated for Admin Vote for her HERE .
Zane T 69 has been nominated for Bureaucrat Vote for him HERE


If you are talking about the notification, then I left it unsigned intentionally. I was trying to make it as unbiased as possible for a notification. --ThomasNealy (talk) 18:29, January 2, 2018 (UTC)

Category Suggestion[]

Hey, i created a blog post about a new category, that i suggested to WarG and he agreed to ask to the others admins, see the post here. Doctor49 (talk) 00:26, January 9, 2018 (UTC)


The debate on what goes on the monster page has been reopened. Your opinion on the issue would be welcome. you can find the link here Talk:Monster#Monsters_omitted_part_2 Thank you--ThomasNealy (talk) 22:52, January 19, 2018 (UTC)

As one of the participants I thought would like to know that Caleb has posted a Notice of Intent to close the discussion. He has also provided an idea on a compromise since he could see no clear resolution from the debate. Your opinion would be welcome on the matter. Thank You. --ThomasNealy (talk) 18:07, February 11, 2018 (UTC)

New Policy Discussion[]

A new policy is being proposed you can find more information here and give your opinion here Standard vote options apply. Thank you. --ThomasNealy (talk) 20:46, February 3, 2018 (UTC)

Template Guide[]

I wanted run an idea by you and the other admins before I started on it to see you you thought it was worth doing or unneeded. I want to make a Guide to our templates. One that will show what they are, what they are used for, and how to use them. once it's done I would like to have it added to the top nav bar if possible. I would also like to review the templates and open talks on deleting ones that have no use any longer. Is this something that you think would be ok? this is what I i have in mind. User:ThomasNealy/sandbox/Template_Guide --ThomasNealy (talk) 18:56, February 4, 2018 (UTC)

Discussion closures[]

Hey FTWinchester, if you have a moment, could I get your help in closing the following discussions:

I don't actually have the time to sift through the discussions and write closing judgments in the next 2 weeks due to real-life matters. Some necessary context for the first discussion can be found here, and I believe would be ideal if you closed it, as you have not been involved in the matter and can thus arbitrate fairly. Thanks! Calebchiam Talk 23:46, February 16, 2018 (UTC)

Thanks for taking a look at them. I notice, though, that you commented on the forum regarding Reka's block, but a closure is still required, i.e. Closed - "some survey and analysis of the arguments presented" + "final action to be taken". Calebchiam Talk 22:53, February 19, 2018 (UTC)


I know that you did a lot of work on the templates for this wiki, so I was hoping that you could give me your opinion on the new changes for the creature template I made. there is a topic for it in the forum. along with the template guide that I posted a few topics up as well. Thanks. --ThomasNealy (talk) 04:01, February 19, 2018 (UTC)


Sorry, I don't really know where to put this, so I figured asking an admin was the best way. Have I been banned for some reason? I haven't been on the wiki for a while and now can't edit anything. I didn't get any notices or anything. JS0662 (talk) 01:10, March 9, 2018 (UTC)


Would it be possible to add a discussion page to this wiki? I feel like it would really help people share their ideas. (And if there is a discussion page, can you please tell me where to find it? I have some ideas I want to share.) HMSquared (talk) 21:40, July 13, 2018 (UTC)


I was curious about something that happened with a page that used to be on here. It was originally called the "Power" page where it listed all of the superpowers in the show, but it's been deleted. I was curious about why and of the possibility of bringing it back? And I don't mean as a category page, I mean a page with every power listed that links to the page of the superpower that you click on. Thanks.


No. I'm not talking about the category page. I mean a page that was titled "Power" and it had listed all the powers and their descriptions on the page. 

DragonWarrior627 (talk) 04:22, November 4, 2018 (UTC)DragonWarrior627DragonWarrior627 (talk) 04:22, November 4, 2018 (UTC)

Thought I'd warn you. Someones trying to get Admin passwords, I think by guessing them. Exercise caution. Zane T 69 (talk) 03:15, February 11, 2019 (UTC)

False alarm, but make sure that your passwords are strong. Zane T 69 (talk) 03:58, February 11, 2019 (UTC)

We have new Content and Discussion Mods: User:Dominic1743 and User:Mgdodl, but that's about it. We had a mass vandal targeting the wiki, but that's over and we have Abuse Filters acting as automated defenses. The wikis running great. Zane T 69 (talk) 17:41, March 17, 2019 (UTC)

Greetings my friend[]

Yo yo yo my friend, Look, over on the Buffy page.. Ellsey is REALLY hassling me big time!!! I don't even know what to do about this user anymore. I tried to even talk it out with him in chat, and he's straight up ignoring me. No idea what he has against me, but he's going to EVERY admin and badmouthing me, where I can read it no doubt. What do you think I should do? It all started when I took it upon myself to start my own episode guide.. with the ep pictures, synopsis, etc... what does he... he starts his OWN. Like, this was MY project... what gave him the right to just up and start his own thing? Now he's like nit-picking EVERYTHING I do. I've been on the Buffy Wiki since 2014, 2015 and this is just getting insane!!!!! What do you think I should do? I'm a bureau, so I had the capability of removing his admin rights- the only reason I did was so that he would STOP undoing and removing the work I've done so far. No idea why he can't just ignore me and go about doing his own business. Thoughts?? I need you my friend. LOL -QueenBuffy (p.s. One thing I /will/ ask of ya, if you don't mind. Could you please tell him to stop bad mouthing me to EVERY admin on the BtVS and Angel page? It's borderline harassment. Thanks :)

I went ahead and let him be admin again but warned him NOT to delete my work thus far and to not put his own work in its place. He REALLY likes using the large promo shots for the infobox images -which is fine, UNLESS they don't pertain to the episode, that's where I have a problem. Like, If I go to see what an episode is about, and the infobox image is just an image of Buffy, that tells me nothing what the ep is about. I also think horizontal ep screencaps are best for the episode guide. I may need your help in trying to relay this to him. Anyway.. sorry I dragged ya into all this, I just needed your help! LOL Talk to you soon, Robyn AKA QueenBuffy
The problem was (before she was made admin by someone) is EVERYTHING, EVERY bit of work I did was undone by her because "her way was the best way". I think personally the infobox image should pertain to the episode it is describing. If there is a promo image that shows that, great... we can use it. SHE wants EVERY infobox to use a promo image regardless if it shows what the episode is about or not... which for me is not the best "guide" when it comes to what Wikia is about. We had a "voting" thing on this, and only one other admin replied and it was in her favor... so she ran with that. I'm just trying to clean up, modernize...etc, but everything is being rollbacked, etc. I really don't know if I can stick around the Buffy Wiki much longer, which is sad, because Buffy is life. :D Feel free to reply here and I will check back from time to time. I'd rather keep this convo private, as I'm trying to mend SOME sort of relationship with this chick. I mean, seriously, LOOK at this she sent me. I feel like Littlefinger being confronted by Sansa! LOL messages (you know, the more I think about it... I can't believe she sent me a message titled "my Work" and sent over some of the errors I have made. I really am starting to feel harrassed by her, since she does not do this to anyone else but me. What are your thoughts?) Thanks boo! QueenBuffy 4/4/2019
I'm going to get with Gonzolo84, because she is STILL trolling me. I don't even know what to do at this point. It's getting.. no, GOTTEN out of hand. Anyway... I'll stop pestering you with it since you don't really edit there anymore lol QueenBuffy 4/11/19

Re: Cheers[]

Hey man, good to see you around here again. Not much to say, the Wiki is chugging along fine, and I'm having a good time IRL as well. Hope all has been well with you too! Calebchiam Talk 21:58, March 19, 2019 (UTC)

Wiki Manager Introduction[]

Hi there!

I'm SilverFlight, here to serve as Supernatural Wiki's liason - the go-to user for when you need assistance from full-time staff and eager to answer if you ever have a question or issue(s) relating to the wiki, users, etc.

In addition, I'm happy to inform you that Fandom is upgrading its MediaWiki platform to accommodate MediaWiki extensions. You can read more about here on the blog post.

If you have any other questions, please contact me on my talk page. Let me know how I can help.

The Silver wings of Night (talk) 02:40, June 21, 2019 (UTC)

Fandom Discord[]

Hello FTWinchester!
I'm excited to let you know that Fandom now has an official Discord server for all Fandom and Gsmepedia editors. If you want to learn more about it, details can be found here on community blog. Let me know if you have any questions!

The Silver wings of Night (talk) 23:02, July 9, 2019 (UTC)

Editor Rewards[]

Hi FTWinchester! I'm happy to tell you that there's a new Editor Rewards program honoring the hard work of users with awards those that have gained recognition for their contributions. Details are on this blog post. If you could give some feedback at this blog post, it would be greatly appreciated. Please message me if you have any questions!

The Silver wings of Night (talk) 01:20, September 2, 2019 (UTC)

Editor Experience[]

Hi FTWinchester! I'm writing to let you know the Supernatural Wiki will have a new tool running on it. This tool is a "user walkthrough experience" and it's meant to help new editors figure out how to edit pages via a virtual tour on the editor itself. As always, please write me back on feedback and thoughts you have!

The Silver wings of Night (talk) 15:57, September 17, 2019 (UTC)

AU Chuck Shurley[]

Hey, please give your opinion here on whether or not the page Chuck Shurley (The End) should be deleted and merged with the page God since it has been confirmed that there's only one version God in the Supernatural multiverse and there's no need/reason to have the "Chuck Shurley (The End)" page in this wiki. Thx. Doctor49 (talk) 01:18, October 18, 2019 (UTC)

Hey, i didn't knew you created the header, i thought you copied from some place or somenthing too, but now i gave you the credits i my talk page. Doctor49 (talk) 16:12, December 1, 2019 (UTC)

Hello. There is currently an important discussion about the wikis future in regards to the soon to be replaced Forums by Fandom. Please get involved here. Zane T 69 (talk) 17:47, November 2, 2019 (UTC)

Global Taxonomy[]

Hi there! I'm happy to introduce to you the new feature called the Global Taxonomy. This formula accumulates wikis a user visits and generates a list of recommended wikis for them to visit. In other words, people who have an interest in a topic or genre you entail will be recommended a chance to visit this wiki! That will be perfect for garnering visitors here. You can read more about it on the blog, plus if you're interested in template use, you can check out this link, too. Hope you find them helpful!

The Silver wings of Night (talk)
22:12, December 1, 2019 (UTC)

Desynoping Inactive Admins[]

Sorry to bother you, but can I get your opinion on Forum:Desynoping Inactive admins? Thanks. Dominic1743 (talk) 10:51, December 15, 2019 (UTC)


I just wanted to inform you that I won't be as active as much due to personal issues. Hopefully my activity will be back to normal before or after the new episode airs. I will try to edit at least once a week.

Thanks! Admin // Dominic1743 (T-C-L) 17:03, February 9, 2020 (UTC)

RE:Reddit Username[]

Um may I ask why you are asking?

M. Warlow 17:41, February 20, 2020 (UTC)

Yes that is me

M. Warlow 17:58, February 20, 2020 (UTC)


M. Warlow 18:41, February 20, 2020 (UTC)

Im not saying this to be sarcastic or mean, i legit am curious, but i find it interesting that you matched my wiki profile with my reddit profile, like i cant believe no one else shares my opinions about supernatural, i must be in a miniority

for example im one of the few fans i suppose who want to see the shedim show up in the show 

M. Warlow 04:40, February 21, 2020 (UTC)

I see

M. Warlow 16:35, February 24, 2020 (UTC)

Pad of Definitions[]

If information has changed or retconned from any specific Pad of Definitions than those should be stated on their respected pages. But as the Pad of Definitions was an official “at the time” canon it should still be included as a whole and changes should be made on a case by case.[[User:Twilight Despair 5|]] ([[The God of Creation]]) (talk) 15:04, February 25, 2020 (UTC)

RE: Pad of Definitions[]

Thanks for letting me know about the current discussion, it is a tricky subject but i already left my opinion there. Doctor49 (talk) 16:22, February 25, 2020 (UTC)

Alastair's Comeback[]

Since you replied to my blog a few days ago (Lilith with her Posuane vs Cain), I wanted to know if you knew about it that Andrew Dabb meant that he was not sure whether we would see Alastair revived like Lilith because he finally grumbles in the void. If so, I would be very interested in how you would find it, when it would reappear and how it would go, or how powerful you would rate it? I posted a blog about it

Anonyme Tät (talk) 20:35, February 27, 2020 (UTC)

RE: Orphaned Pages[]

Yeah, i've seen these special lages before but forgot how to access them, so i've been searching for this and the other special pages i added in my profile for sometime, but i didn't knew how to find then, i couldn't find it even searching in this wiki, i had to serch in the fandom wiki itself and then adapt the link so i could get access to the special pages with the info from this wiki. Anyway, after i'm done with the orphan pages i'm gonna try to make a clean up in the image categories too since i found a special page for that (btw, there are some very specific special pages huh? :v). Doctor49 (talk) 21:00, February 27, 2020 (UTC)

Your new Wiki Manager[]

Hey there! I'm Cörey, the new Wiki Manager for the Supernatural wiki.

I'll be taking over for SilverFlight. Just like Julia, I'm here to help out however I can. Just let me know! You can usually find me on Discord (my username is penguinstyles#9735), however, I'm happy to use whatever contact medium you prefer.

If you have any questions for me, please let me know. I'll try to respond to them as quickly as I can.

-- Cörey (talk) 05:53, March 2, 2020 (UTC)


Wanted to let you know we now have a discord and you are welcome to sign up preferably with your existing username.

Thanks! Admin // Dominic1743 (T-C-L) 05:33, March 3, 2020 (UTC)

Are you interested in joining the discord server or Discord itself ? --Mgdodl (talk) 10:30, April 2, 2020 (UTC)

Unbiased Review[]

You may have recently received a notification about a message on Dominic1743's "Personal wiki" and that is what this is in regards too. I blocked Dominic, pending review, for three months for vote stacking and stealth canvassing and I'm trying to find trustworthy, experienced, and bi-partial users to review his actions and the block implemented. I will disclose that Dominic recently accepted nomination of an RfB (Request for Bureaucrat rights) and apart from a factual correction about my activity; I viewed it as misinformation to create a need for another bureaucrat roll for Dominic to fill, it seemed entirely above-board and seemed run honestly. If you receive this message then I want your opinion on if the block was justified and if his offenses were accurately described.

For the "offenses" please refer here. Zane T 69 (talk) 21:56, March 6, 2020 (UTC)

Yes, it was resolved peacefully. Zane T 69 (talk) 18:48, March 25, 2020 (UTC)

No problem. I take this requested duty very seriously. Zane T 69 (talk) 20:19, March 25, 2020 (UTC)


Do you know, who's behind Flashy-Crazy on Reddit ?--Mgdodl (talk) 17:57, March 25, 2020 (UTC)

We are talking about a user.--Mgdodl (talk) 18:07, March 25, 2020 (UTC)

My bad, I forgot the link.--Mgdodl (talk) 18:18, March 25, 2020 (UTC)

Well, I don't want to let you wait any longer, behind the user is nobody else, but the guy, who's writing with you about Reddit on the wiki.--Mgdodl (talk) 18:53, March 25, 2020 (UTC)

It's me, I created the account, a while ago and followed you on Reddit.--Mgdodl (talk) 19:02, March 25, 2020 (UTC)

I have absolutely no clue how and I read that isn't possible, but could you see my profile or not, because on my Reddit profile, it's obvious who I am, because I added my username Mgdodl and a part of my Discord username Gabriel417 on my profile.--Mgdodl (talk) 19:10, March 25, 2020 (UTC)


No problem. The thing is that thing's name is really freaking confusing. Naomi calls it the Shadow, it called itself "the friendly neighborhood Cosmic Entity" (which is the name the other Wiki gives it: Cosmic Entity) and a bunch of people call it the Empty like its the realm itself.--WarGrowlmon18 (talk) 18:49, March 25, 2020 (UTC)

Or if its literally a manifestation of the Empty. Maybe its not just a realm but a conscious being. Kind of like Tartarus in Percy Jackson.--WarGrowlmon18 (talk) 20:38, March 25, 2020 (UTC)

Yeah freaking tell me about it!!!--WarGrowlmon18 (talk) 19:22, April 1, 2020 (UTC)

Azazel's Death[]

Hey do you own any of these companion books and if so, can you confirm what is in the books about Azazel's death? Did Dean shoot him in the heart or in a main artery. Did Dean Winchester shoot Azazel at all in the heart or rather pierced the immediate arteries or the left lung? 12:47, May 17, 2020 (UTC)

Wiki Discord and Reddit[]

Hello, fellow admin, since you're a mod on Reddit and the majority of admins and wiki users are on our Discord server could you share it, so that the users could see it on Reddit ? --Mgdodl (talk) 23:33, May 17, 2020 (UTC)

Well, you could do one thing, log in to Discord and join the server, yourself, following the example of the majority of admins on the wiki, but would've not have to be active necessarily, others which have time could handle that.--Mgdodl (talk) 20:54, May 19, 2020 (UTC)

Can you sign into our wikis Discord? People are impersonating you and causing trouble. Zane T 69 (talk) 04:17, May 23, 2020 (UTC)

I'm to understand that's the reason, to make sure we know which one is you. I think they were spamming, trolling, or verbally abusing people. If you want to know specifics then you can ask Mgdodl. Yes, Mgdodl, Dominic, and a few others are managing the Discord. Zane T 69 (talk) 21:31, May 25, 2020 (UTC)


Ok, Thanks!! Admin//Dominic1743 (talk) 22:18, June 2, 2020 (UTC)

You can log out now and never use it again if you want. Admin//Dominic1743 (talk) 22:29, June 2, 2020 (UTC)


To be honest, I haven't noticed. I haven't been on here much recently, frankly because there's not really much to update recently.--WarGrowlmon18 (talk) 07:16, July 26, 2020 (UTC)

I haven't had that problem. How often do you clean your computer with programs like CCleaner or defragment it? How many windows do you commonly have open when trying to edit and are you watching videos or streaming music? Is your computer old? Zane T 69 (talk) 15:49, August 7, 2020 (UTC)

Then the only advice that I can offer is to continue using the classic editor. Zane T 69 (talk) 19:03, August 7, 2020 (UTC)

Please check your email 🙂[]

Hello! I recently sent you an email but haven't received a response yet. Could you check your inbox and get back to me? Thanks!

× Cörey (talk) 23:34, 13 December 2020 (UTC)

New Wiki Rep & a few updates[]

Hi there! I'm Kylara, and I'm a member of the Wiki Representatives team with the Movies/TV vertical. Fandom is doing some internal reorganizing with its teams, I'll be picking up as the community's Wiki Rep (formerly named Wiki Manager). Just like with Cörey, I'm here to help and support the community, so let me know if you have any questions! Cörey has given given me notes on the wiki and its community to get me up to speed, but I'd love to hear from you about your thoughts on it. So how's it been going around here on Supernatural Wiki? Have any concerns or hopes or wish-list items? Any issues or changes you'd like to see here? Let me know!

You will have received a couple email messages from Fandom recently, and I want to make sure you don't miss them. They were sent to the email associated with your Fandom account. If you didn't receive them, please double-check the email associated with your Fandom account and let me know, and I'll request that they be re-sent.

The Monthly - One email is an invite to The Monthly, a private webinar-style event hosted by our Global Community Lead, Will 'MisterWoodhouse' Kavanagh. This series will cover important topics affecting the wiki platform, giving a briefing from Fandom. The first edition of The Monthly is this Friday, February 26th with two opportunities to join: 9am and 4pm US Eastern time. Future editions of The Monthly will be the final Friday of each month, schedule permitting.

Roundtable discussion - Another email is an invite to an admin/mod roundtable this Monday, March 1st. This is a smaller group for admin and mods of wikis of some shows from The CW, where you'll be able to discuss and give feedback directly to our community managers.

Policies - I also wanted to make sure you saw the recent staff blog on Wiki Rules and Blocking Policy. I checked the wiki's policy pages, and there's some good content in the policy category, but perhaps Supernatural Wiki:Policy could be better developed as a central guide? With the upcoming changes, this is a good time to do a full policy review, and it if there's anything you tend to block for that might be unexpected, please make sure it's stated clearly.

Discord - I'm also a member of your wiki's Discord, so feel free to ping me or DM me.

Let me know if you have any questions! I look forward to working with you and the community!

– KylaraE  (talk) 22:44, 24 February 2021 (UTC)

Hey there, me again. Wanted to let you know that The Monthly is happening again on Friday, March 26th, at two times: 10am-11am EST and 5pm-6pm EST. If you haven't yet, please find the first email sent to the registered email on your account, and click the link to either opt in or opt out. (I'm told that the links appear broken when clicked, but they are in fact still correctly logging whether you're interested or not.) Let me know if this is something you're interested in. – KylaraE  (talk) 00:07, 20 March 2021 (UTC)


Hey again, I'm gathering feedback regarding the upcoming change to the desktop skin, called FandomDesktop, to help our team address any early concerns before we get to rollout and testing. Check out this staff blog if you haven't yet, and let me know your thoughts?

Some notable portions:

  • Light and Dark modes - A wiki can basically have two theme options, and users can pick their preference.
  • Fluid width - The content area can be expanded, and the right rail can also be collapsed, for a wider article page.
  • Global navigation - Instead of being on the top as it is now, it will be placed as a narrow bar on the left.
  • Local top navigation - This will now scroll with you as you move down the page, so you don't have to scroll back to the top to access the wiki's main navigate.
  • Header - Backgrounds are basically being replaced with a wide top header image.

Some pretty big changes to come! So if you have any thoughts or feedback or concerns, either good and bad, please let me know.

– KylaraE  (talk) 23:02, 9 April 2021 (UTC)

FandomDesktop opt-in and theme prep[]

Hey again! I wanted to make sure you haven't missed that FandomDesktop opt-in is open for testing, and you can make changes such as updating the theme to prepare for rollout. Please check it out if you haven't yet, and let me know if you have any feedback, questions, or concerns, I'm here to help!

I may look around and make some tweaks to help get the wiki ready, so that it'll be presentable on both light and dark themes. Do you think you or one of the other admin might be interested in developing a header image for the new skin theme design? Let me know if you see any issues, need any help with updates, or have any requests.

– KylaraE  (talk) 06:29, 18 June 2021 (UTC)


Hey. I just wanted to give you an update that Zane is having Tech problems and he wont be able to do anything for a while, so we need to increase activity to protect the wiki. Dominic1743 (talk) 05:49, 9 July 2021 (UTC)